Are Taycans the bargains of the Porsche model lineup?

[TDinDC]

Has anyone else ever used the Porsche configurator to build other models using roughly the same options as you have on your Taycan build?

I know that, obviously, some models are closer to the Taycan than others, but, as you fellow Porsche owners know, the options and technology (aside from EV drivetrain) can be very similar across model lines.

I think in order of similarity it would be Panamera, Cayenne, 911, Macan, Boxster/Cayman.

When I do this, particularly with respect to Cayennes and 911s, I am always surprised by how much more expensive the other models are for builds with very similar options. On top of that, the Taycan has competitive (or better) performance and equal or superior interior space.

So, even though each model has a different primary target driver in mind and these comparisons are really apples or oranges, I would have expected the Taycans to be more expensive with similar configurations rather than less expensive, and that doesn't seem to be the case. I expect that they are being subsidized for the purpose of meeting fleet wide efficiency standards, right?

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[WasserGKuehlt]

So, even though each model has a different primary target driver in mind and these comparisons are really apples or oranges, I would have expected the Taycans to be more expensive with similar configurations rather than less expensive, and that doesn't seem to be the case. I expect that they are being subsidized for the purpose of meeting fleet wide efficiency standards, right?

I don't think there are subsidies, but rather simply an example of the efficacy - overall, not just for energy consumption - of EVs. There is a huge difference, as you well know, between the various trims of, say, the 911 from base to turbo or GT. Not only that, but either the design must account for all motorization options upfront (992 only comes in 'wide' body, for instance), or the specialization effort for a higher-level trim is a significant deviation from base (the bonkers 992 GT3 RS, for instance). So as you go up, there is _real_ cost, which allows for a clearer separation between trims, and protects the profit margin for each model. (Say you make less on the base 911, but it also costs less assembly time and/or materials.)

EVs, otoh, are virtually identical, and the platform _must_ be designed upfront for all flavors: there's basically 2 batteries, and 2-3 motors of virtually identical material and assembly cost. (Well, not the batteries, but it's linear.) That makes the range both more compact in terms of price spread, and ensures a higher profit margin - the Turbo S really isn't 2x more expensive to make than the RWB with a small battery. Add, on top of that, a vastly simplified interior (no buttons - less assembly time, less material cost) that is shared across the range.

tl;dr: yes, it is the "optimal" model line from a cost perspective, and even so Porsche is getting away with charging exorbitant prices for accessories and other optionals.

 

[WuffvonTrips]

Coming from a Cayenne (non-coupe), I feel that the Taycan CT has significantly less interior space.
On paper at least, the e-Hybrid Cayenne isn't far off a Taycan 4S in terms of acceleration (though in reality, it doesn't feel like that close).
At first glance, a similarly spec'd Cayenne e-Hybrid appears to be around £10k cheaper than a comparable Taycan CT 4S. EDIT- and cheaper than a comparable CT 4.

 

[TDinDC]

Interesting. I am really focused on pricing. Funny that you mention the Cayenne e-hybrid, as that is one of the exact models I had in mind. My Taycan CT spec was US$181K. A similar spec on the visualizer for the Cayenne e-hybrid is US$210K, which is actually what led me to create this thread.

 

[WuffvonTrips]

Interesting. I am really focused on pricing. Funny that you mention the Cayenne e-hybrid, as that is one of the exact models I had in mind. My Taycan CT spec was US$181K. A similar spec on the visualizer for the Cayenne e-hybrid is US$210K, which is actually what led me to create this thread.

That sounds more like a Cayenne S e-hybrid price (and slightly better acceleration figures than a Taycan 4S) rather than the e-hybrid?

 

[daveo4EV]

the words "bargin" and "porsche" in the same post

thank you - super funny - best I've heard all week -

 

[TDinDC]

That sounds more like a Cayenne S e-hybrid price (and slightly better acceleration figures than a Taycan 4S) rather than the e-hybrid?

Yes, Cayenne Turbo S e-hybrid. When you look at performance specs, the Taycan CT 4S has more HP and there is only a 0.3s difference in 0-60, so I view that Cayenne model as the "closest" comparison.

 

[WuffvonTrips]

Yes, Cayenne Turbo S e-hybrid. When you look at performance specs, the Taycan CT 4S has more HP and there is only a 0.3s difference in 0-60, so I view that Cayenne model as the "closest" comparison.

I think you're not including the electric motor- the Turbo S E-hybrid has a combined 680 PS & 900 Nm.

 

[TDinDC]

I think you're not including the electric motor- the Turbo S E-hybrid has a combined 680 PS & 900 Nm.

You may be right. Damned comparison tool is unnecessarily complicated. But they are still very close on acceleration stats, which I think is more important, and we all know that EVs are hard to beat on torque, so don’t you think this is the closest model for comparison? Maybe just a plain Cayenne Turbo would be closer?

 

[WuffvonTrips]

You may be right. Damned comparison tool is unnecessarily complicated. But they are still very close on acceleration stats, which I think is more important, and we all know that EVs are hard to beat on torque, so don’t you think this is the closest model for comparison?

I reckon the 4S splits the difference between the e-hybrid and the Turbo S e-hybrid (which is the top dog in the Cayenne range). Without looking, I think the Panamera may offer an S (not Turbo S) e-hybrid that may be more comparable with the Taycan 4S- and being a Panamera I'd expect it would cost more than an equivalent 4S.
Anyway, I don't want to dispute your assessment that the Taycan is the bargain of the Porsche family- I called up my man maths to justify my "sensible" Taycan purchase to my other half

 

[TDinDC]

I reckon the 4S splits the difference between the e-hybrid and the Turbo S e-hybrid (which is the top dog in the Cayenne range). Without looking, I think the Panamera may offer an S (not Turbo S) e-hybrid that may be more comparable with the Taycan 4S- and being a Panamera I'd expect it would cost more than an equivalent 4S.
Anyway, I don't want to dispute your assessment that the Taycan is the bargain of the Porsche family- I called up my man maths to justify my "sensible" Taycan purchase to my other half

No, I appreciate you pointing that out to me. I also just realized how much the price has gone up for my build now. Yikes.

In any event, If I use the Cayenne Turbo and try to build as close as possible to each other, the price is pretty close (although I would still prefer mine). But the fact that my 4S competes with Turbo is pretty good . . .

http://www.porsche-code.com/PPGRLRT5

http://www.porsche-code.com/PPR6RPZ5

 

[TDinDC]

Here is the comparable build for the Panamera S e-hybrid.

http://www.porsche-code.com/PPS25G68

 

[WuffvonTrips]

In any event, If I use the Cayenne Turbo and try to build as close as possible to each other, the price is pretty close (although I would still prefer mine). But the fact that my 4S competes with Turbo is pretty good . . .

Wow- I won't call your 4S "fully-loaded"- but only because it doesn't seem right to associate Taycans with Pizza.
Although I ended up with a Turbo (more man-maths to make the case), I concluded from my initial test of a 4S that I'd rather have its (the 4S) real-world power delivery (flexibility and silence) than that of any Cayenne or Panamera variant.

 

[TDinDC]

Wow- I won't call your 4S "fully-loaded"- but only because it doesn't seem right to associate Taycans with Pizza.
Although I ended up with a Turbo (more man-maths to make the case), I concluded from my initial test of a 4S that I'd rather have its (the 4S) real-world power delivery (flexibility and silence) than that of any Cayenne or Panamera variant.

I mean, it feels as fast as the higher version of the other models, right? That's sort of what I mean by being a relative bargain, although the old pricing if my build is part of what I based the thoughts on not having realized how much the prices have increased since just a few months . . . Yikes.

 

[WuffvonTrips]

I mean, it feels as fast as the higher version of the other models, right?

I found the 4S acceleration to be almost literally stunning, not felt anything like it in similar (on-paper) acceleration performance ICEs or hybrids. I think the thrill of ICE comes from roaring effort, whereas the thrill of the EV is the apparently uncanny effortlessness.

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