cometguy

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@cometguy As for ground clearance, there was an official Porsche Instagram post (@porsche_newsroom) a few days ago that specifically mentioned the upcoming announcement for the Cross Turismo and that it had increased ground clearance. I doubt Luke is allowed to say anything before the announcement, even if he knows, but that was either confirmation or a massive mistake. It would also be silly to call it a cross turismo if they were just throwing a hatch on it.

I am also surprised as it sure doesn't look like it has additional ground clearance in photos. It makes me wonder if it's really an additional or expanded "lift" selection from the air suspension.. ie, it can be as low as the normal Taycan but can also raise higher, or just the "lift" functioning at all speeds rather than only below 15 mph.
I don't quite follow your remark that it would "be silly to call it a cross turismo if they were just throwing a hatch on it", even if you're taking literally that "cross" refers to "crossover" (and noting that the Taycan sedan is a hatchback, but I know that you meant to say "wagon"). Yes, the concept CT *did* have increased ground clearance, looking more like a Volvo Cross Country wagon or an Audi Allroad wagon in that regard. The Panamera Sport Turismo is no further raised than is the Panamera sedan (both of which I have owned). Yes, I'm asking the question because I'd like a wagon with a higher ground clearance (by an inch or two) without having to get into SUV territory, if possible. I understand also that Luke may not have that information, or that he can't release it if he does, but I thought I'd try asking. :)
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PanameraFrank

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I don't quite follow your remark that it would "be silly to call it a cross turismo if they were just throwing a hatch on it", even if you're taking literally that "cross" refers to "crossover" (and noting that the Taycan sedan is a hatchback, but I know that you meant to say "wagon"). The Panamera Sport Turismo is no further raised than is the Panamera sedan. Yes, I'm asking the question because I'd like a wagon with a higher ground clearance (by an inch or two) without having to get into SUV territory, if possible. I understand also that Luke may not have that information, or that he can't release it if he does, but I thought I'd try asking. :)
I'm saying if they were just giving it the wagon treatment it'd be a Taycan "Sport Turismo" but "Cross Turismo", per the concept, implies it will in fact have a higher ground clearance.

That was confirmed by the official Porsche instagram post. It's just unclear whether that will be a setting in the air suspension or whether the car will always ride higher than the Taycan Sedan. But it will have additional ground clearance. "with even more space and ground clearance now"

 

REIL

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Luke, it’s wonderful that you’re doing this thread. I’ve read a lot of it but not all 34 pages (yet)… lol..

My next question for you is whether you know for sure that Porsche is not going to come out with a Macan e-hybrid (PHEV). We know that Porsche’s next BEV to be introduced after the Taycan is the new all-electric Macan, and I don’t know if it will get a new name at that point (?). I did read one online reporter’s article saying that "Porsche" stated (no Porsche person was cited) there’d be no Macan PHEV because the battery pack is too large to fit in, but this doesn’t really make sense, as the Macan is not that much smaller than the Cayenne (or the RAV4 Prime, which has an 18-kWh battery pack). I, for one, would be happy to give up a little interior rear cargo space in a Macan to have an 18-kWh battery pack. If a Macan e-hybrid were to be released, I would think that it would be done in a couple years when the Macan BEV is released.
Car and Driver two days ago regarding Macan ICE versions for three more years. No plug-in hybrid.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a30852062/porsche-macan-gasoline-electric/
 
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cometguy

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cometguy

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I'm saying if they were just giving it the wagon treatment it'd be a Taycan "Sport Turismo" but "Cross Turismo", per the concept, implies it will in fact have a higher ground clearance.

That was confirmed by the official Porsche instagram post. It's just unclear whether that will be a setting in the air suspension or whether the car will always ride higher than the Taycan Sedan. But it will have additional ground clearance. "with even more space and ground clearance now"

Thanks for posting that... interesting that it says "the perfect car for the Australian Outback" -- so maybe it will be more raised than the "spy-photo" cars suggest... Most Porsches only allow the high-lift mode in air suspension up to about 18-20 mph...
 


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LukeManning

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Yes, those remarks have been officially made by Porsche numerous times -- that the Macan ICEV will be sold along side the Macan BEV for some years. But Porsche has not made any official remarks about a possible Macan e-hybrid, as far as I can see, despite making lots of comments in recent months officially about expanding their electrified line-up in the coming years as both BEVs *and* PHEVs. So I am asking Luke if he has any information along these lines of a possible Macan e-hybrid. As I said, the logical time for Porsche to reveal such a PHEV would be around they time of unveiling the Macan BEV.
I really think Porsche's best strategy with the Macan will be to go fully electric. I haven't heard any rumors of an E-Hybrid variant of the Macan - but I really think unless the battery technology they were to implement in the car could occupy less space and pack more energy density than it currently does that the contrants of the size of the Macan would make it disadvantageous to do an E-Hybrid variant.

I truly think a full BEV Macan would probably be one of the best decisions Porsche would ever make, and if executed correctly I think would outsell a Tesla Model 3 or Y if given the production bandwidth needed while still maintaining a somewhat reasonable Premium EV SUV price.

Imagine the handling and solidity of something like a Macan GTS, with the user interface of something closer resembling a 911/Cayenne interior but with the instantaneous torque and driving dynamics of a Taycan... That would be epic. Whereas I feel a Macan E-Hybrid would probably feel slower and more cumbersome than any of the Macan models except for perhaps the base 4-clyinder...

As far as information I have heard, Porsche plans to release a EV Macan alongside the current ICE Macan variant as early as 2022 with it being slated for a 2023 model. I think the current variant of the Macan could continue to sell into a 2023 model or even 2023 with slight tweaks and still sell in a pretty decent volume, but who knows. We shall see!
 
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LukeManning

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@cometguy As for ground clearance, there was an official Porsche Instagram post (@porsche_newsroom) a few days ago that specifically mentioned the upcoming announcement for the Cross Turismo and that it had increased ground clearance. I doubt Luke is allowed to say anything before the announcement, even if he knows, but that was either confirmation or a massive mistake. It would also be silly to call it a cross turismo if they were just throwing a hatch on it.

I am also surprised as it sure doesn't look like it has additional ground clearance in photos. It makes me wonder if it's really an additional or expanded "lift" selection from the air suspension.. ie, it can be as low as the normal Taycan but can also raise higher, or just the "lift" functioning at all speeds rather than only below 15 mph.
It is my understanding that the Taycan Cross Turismo (which yes is officially coming and should be released later this year, with production slated for late 2022) will have a higher ride height and more "off-road" (I use that term very very lightly cause let's be honest most folks aren't taking their $125k+++ Taycan off road) features that will come standard and optional on the vehicle.

In the Porsche lineup I think we will continue to see Sport Turismo and Cross Turismo variants being released. It is my understanding that a Sport Turismo will essentially be a wagon version of a car i.e. Panamera Sport Turismo, and won't have any additional off road or ride height capabilities. Whereas the Cross Turismo will have most off road features and not just be focused on being a wagonified vehicle. Not sure what other models Porsche could Cross/Sport Turismoify, but who knows.

Only issue with both of these cars is that unfortunately in the United States, and especially in the Southern US, these cars sell terribly. People like the idea of them, but rarely does anyone walk into a dealership and just want to buy one off the showroom floor. As a dealership we made a decision not to order any Panamera Cross Turismo moving forward unless a client requests the car, and I imagine this will also continue with the Taycan Cross Turismo unless sales numbers indicate otherwise.

Either way, super excited to see more Porsche BEV vehicles getting designed/tested/and eventually released.
 
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In the Porsche lineup I think we will continue to see Sport Turismo and Cross Turismo variants being released. It is my understanding that a Sport Turismo will essentially be a wagon version of a car i.e. Panamera Cross Turismo, and won't have any additional off road or ride height capabilities. Whereas the Cross Turismo will have most off road features and not just be focused on being a wagonified vehicle. Not sure what other models Porsche could Cross/Sport Turismoify, but who knows.
In that case, how high are the chances of Porsche producing both a Sport Turismo & a Cross Turismo? IMO, my dream Porsche would be a fully electric Panamera Sport Turismo (executive rear seats specifically! Though I'm sure that's not likely for the Taycan) and Porsche might get really close to that if they end up releasing a Sport Turismo variant.
 


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I really think Porsche's best strategy with the Macan will be to go fully electric. I haven't heard any rumors of an E-Hybrid variant of the Macan - but I really think unless the battery technology they were to implement in the car could occupy less space and pack more energy density than it currently does that the contrants of the size of the Macan would make it disadvantageous to do an E-Hybrid variant.

I truly think a full BEV Macan would probably be one of the best decisions Porsche would ever make, and if executed correctly I think would outsell a Tesla Model 3 or Y if given the production bandwidth needed while still maintaining a somewhat reasonable Premium EV SUV price.

Imagine the handling and solidity of something like a Macan GTS, with the user interface of something closer resembling a 911/Cayenne interior but with the instantaneous torque and driving dynamics of a Taycan... That would be epic. Whereas I feel a Macan E-Hybrid would probably feel slower and more cumbersome than any of the Macan models except for perhaps the base 4-clyinder...

As far as information I have heard, Porsche plans to release a EV Macan alongside the current ICE Macan variant as early as 2022 with it being slated for a 2023 model. I think the current variant of the Macan could continue to sell into a 2023 model or even 2023 with slight tweaks and still sell in a pretty decent volume, but who knows. We shall see!
What’s really needed now IMO is for Porsche to take the Rimac technology which I have heard is amazing in terms of Battery energy density and battery management and use this to quickly accelerate the next gen of BEVs. Porsche have a stake in Rimac and could really take the market forwards in a big way doing this.

However, I think they are just going to exploit the J1 platform architecture across their range and the VW Group, like Audi has already with the eTron GT. I don’t blame them as they probably want to profit from the existing investments - but they have access/potential to so much more.
 

Guards Red Car

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I am Confused… Will we see Taycan CROSS Turismo in Summer, 2021 or Late 2022 ??



Per Porsche Newsroom….

Expect the World Premiere of the all-new Taycan Cross Turismo to take place in less than eight weeks. In dealerships as early as this summer






Luke

It is my understanding that the Taycan Cross Turismo (which yes is officially coming and should be released later this year, with production slated for late 2022)
 

cometguy

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Whereas I feel a Macan E-Hybrid would probably feel slower and more cumbersome than any of the Macan models except for perhaps the base 4-clyinder...
Thanks for responding. As for this comment about a Macan e-hybrid (not that it matters, because apparently Car and Driver heard from Porsche that it won't be coming due to battery-pack size): my Panamera 4 E-Hybrid has 461 hp and 516 lb-ft of torque, as does the Cayenne E-Hybrid -- both with V6 engines. Because V6 engines are also used in the Macan, I see no reason why they couldn't put *more than* 461 hp and 516 lb-ft of torque into a Macan E-Hybrid because it's a lighter vehicle (smaller size). And trust me, my Panamera 4 E-Hybrid is much faster and more fun than a Panamera 4S (with more hp and torque), and it approaches the Panamera (ICE-only, V8) Turbo in power and torque. A Macan e-hybrid would be an absolute homerun. I would wager that a Macan e-hybrid would be faster and more fun to drive than a Macan GTS or Turbo.

And, as for Sport Turismo Panameras being rare in the US, yes, that's sadly true. I'm a wagon fanatic and love my Panamera Sport Turismo (much better than my previous Panamera sedan); it has more space, better rear-window visibility, and it looks better (in my opinion). That's also why I'm waiting for the Taycan Cross Turismo. But in Europe, I understand that the Sport Turismo sells very well, and half of all Panameras sold in Europe are E-Hybrids. Thank goodness for European "good taste", or we wouldn't have these options in the US! :)
 

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And, as for Sport Turismo Panameras being rare in the US, yes, that's sadly true. I'm a wagon fanatic and love my Panamera Sport Turismo (much better than my previous Panamera sedan); it has more space, better rear-window visibility, and it looks better (in my opinion). That's also why I'm waiting for the Taycan Cross Turismo. But in Europe, I understand that the Sport Turismo sells very well, and half of all Panameras sold in Europe are E-Hybrids. Thank goodness for European "good taste", or we wouldn't have these options in the US! :)
I will definitely be one of 5 other people who orders a Taycan Sport (I wish!) Cross Turismo w/the Executive Rear Seat package, if they ever decide to release it for the Taycan.
 

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Certainly!

Allocation:

This is the slot provided (allocated) by Porsche for us to configure a vehicle. Porsche Corporate dictates how many slots that each dealership receives to build cars for our inventory. New allocations arrive every month and have to be ordered by the New Car Director/Manager or the GM of the Dealership. Allocations are utilized for building Client Order Vehicles (if a dealer has any), Stock Inventory Vehicles (that go on the lot), and Service Loaners (if a dealer has any). The number of allocations are usually based on how many vehicles that a dealer sold in the prior year. The more cars a dealership has sold, the more allocations they will receive (especially for specialty cars such as GT, Turbo, Turbo S, etc). Allocations are also based on business planning/demand for certain areas from Porsche. For example a NYC dealership might receive less allocations for per se Taycan in 2021 than a Texas or California dealer would in 2021.

Order:

This is what we refer to a vehicle as once a client has placed a specially commissioned order on a vehicle allocation slot that we have. The allocation slot changes to what is known as KF Status in our system, or Customer Order Vehicle in German. The order is sent to Porsche in Germany where they begin the production process.

Build:

This can also be referred to as the "Configuration" and is what the client has designed the car to be. All cars are configured/built online at Porsche.com and then the Porsche Code is entered into the dealership Sales and Vehicle Management system to be sent off to Porsche in Germany as an order demand. Eventually, the build gets locked in and changes to what is known as V250 Status where changes can no longer be made to the build. Until that point, changes may be made to color, options, design, etc of your specific vehicle build. After V250 it locks in and changes can no longer be made.

Delivery:

This is the expected date that Porsche tracking determines that the car should be able to be delivered to a client. They are usually fairly accurate about delivery timing, but sometimes the delivery date will change. It is a very complex process to order a vehicle and there are many moving parts. While Porsche does its best to give an estimated delivery date, this is not always the exact day that you'll take the vehicle home. I also remind folks that once the car arrives here at the dealership it is covered in many different protective plastics that must be removed, the car will have to go through a Pre Drive Inspection (PDI) and a Full Exterior and Interior Detail before it is ready to be sold, which usually takes at least 1-3 days.

Hi Luke

ONE more question

HOW soon after Porsche debuts a new model (for the USA for example) can I option out/configure/build and submit to my Client Advisor

Does the Dealer receive an official allocation (or allocations) instantaneously upon the unveiling of a new model?

I am eagerly awaiting the debut of the Taycan Cross Turismo and want to put in my order ASAP upon its' official introduction by Porsche

Thanks Luke !!
Certainly!

Allocation:

This is the slot provided (allocated) by Porsche for us to configure a vehicle. Porsche Corporate dictates how many slots that each dealership receives to build cars for our inventory. New allocations arrive every month and have to be ordered by the New Car Director/Manager or the GM of the Dealership. Allocations are utilized for building Client Order Vehicles (if a dealer has any), Stock Inventory Vehicles (that go on the lot), and Service Loaners (if a dealer has any). The number of allocations are usually based on how many vehicles that a dealer sold in the prior year. The more cars a dealership has sold, the more allocations they will receive (especially for specialty cars such as GT, Turbo, Turbo S, etc). Allocations are also based on business planning/demand for certain areas from Porsche. For example a NYC dealership might receive less allocations for per se Taycan in 2021 than a Texas or California dealer would in 2021.

Order:

This is what we refer to a vehicle as once a client has placed a specially commissioned order on a vehicle allocation slot that we have. The allocation slot changes to what is known as KF Status in our system, or Customer Order Vehicle in German. The order is sent to Porsche in Germany where they begin the production process.

Build:

This can also be referred to as the "Configuration" and is what the client has designed the car to be. All cars are configured/built online at Porsche.com and then the Porsche Code is entered into the dealership Sales and Vehicle Management system to be sent off to Porsche in Germany as an order demand. Eventually, the build gets locked in and changes to what is known as V250 Status where changes can no longer be made to the build. Until that point, changes may be made to color, options, design, etc of your specific vehicle build. After V250 it locks in and changes can no longer be made.

Delivery:

This is the expected date that Porsche tracking determines that the car should be able to be delivered to a client. They are usually fairly accurate about delivery timing, but sometimes the delivery date will change. It is a very complex process to order a vehicle and there are many moving parts. While Porsche does its best to give an estimated delivery date, this is not always the exact day that you'll take the vehicle home. I also remind folks that once the car arrives here at the dealership it is covered in many different protective plastics that must be removed, the car will have to go through a Pre Drive Inspection (PDI) and a Full Exterior and Interior Detail before it is ready to be sold, which usually takes at least 1-3 days.

In response to your other questions:

I have heard from various Client Advisors statements such as...."I have an allocation for an April build" ... This means you have an allocation for an April slot, which after inputting the build will give you a delivery timeframe, usually anywhere form 3-6 months out depending on the car.

or "I have an allocation for an order" .... You have an allocation slot to place an custom order (specifically commissioned car design) into.

or "I should be seeing an allocation for a Cross Turismo in the third quarter for a build date of ...." Meaning we should start receiving allocations to start building Taycan Cross Turismo in Q3 of 2021 with a build date around 3-6 months out from there.


What is typical timeline between Allocation to Finalizing Order (i.e. option selection for the final "Build") It really depends on the Allocation slot. For example, I currently have Allocations out until March. If you filled a March allocation slots now, you would have until March before the allocation gets submitted, and then a few weeks after that before it reaches V250 status. That being said, I also have allocations that lock in tomorrow for certain cars so it really just depends on what you're trying to accomplish.

to actual Build Date to actual Delivery (I'm sure it is quite variable, just looking for the middle of the bell shaped curve) Very variable. From the V250 timeframe to end of production usually takes around 1-1.5 months. After production completion, the car goes to Port Emden in Germany which usually takes around a week. Then it enters a cargo vessel bound for your country. Depending on where you live, let's take the US for example, this delivery process might take upwards of 1-2 months for the cargo vessel to arrive at a Port. From there the vehicle is transported from the Port to your dealership on Transport Trucks, which may take anywhere from 1-2 weeks depending on where you live again. All in all I'd say a typical order takes anywhere from 3-4 months, but some orders for some specialty cars can take anywhere from 4-6 months or more.



And one final question, is Atlanta PEC still running full steam for deliveries (despite Pandemic) - and, does Atlanta PEC delivery experience DELAY or SHORTEN the process from Allocation to Ordering to Build to Delivery?? Yes, they are still doing the Atlanta and Los Angeles PEC Deliveries despite the Pandemic. It is an additional $500 cost and the car will come into the PEC of your choosing. I do remind clients it is up to you to figure out how you're getting your vehicle home, whether you need to arrange that with the dealership prior or not is up to you. It definitely DELAYS the process slightly, especially if you factor in transporting/driving your car back to your home.


I hope this helped answer some questions! I'm sure I'm missing some things, but at least gives you a general overview of the ordering process.
 

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Hi Luke

ONE more question

HOW soon after Porsche debuts a new model (for the USA for example) can I option out/configure/build and submit to my Client Advisor

Does the Dealer receive an official allocation (or allocations) instantaneously upon the unveiling of a new model?

I am eagerly awaiting the debut of the Taycan Cross Turismo and want to put in my order ASAP upon its' official introduction by Porsche

Thanks Luke !!
 

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I have the same issue. Even the ParkAssist volume will default to Regular every time I start the car.
I have the same issue as well (system doesn't remember changes).
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