Car died over night…

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daveo4EV

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I’m just going to leave this here in the hopes of giving people an insight as to where we are with this problem - I firmly believe it’s a software fault - and to date there is no “fix” - Porsche is probably still fairly lost with regards to this issue…I believe the pic I’m attaching nicely summarizes the status of this issue…optimistically I think Porsche might be in stage 3, but they are probably on stage 2 or 1.5. It’s probably safe to assume we’re a long ways off from stage 5…

Porsche Taycan Car died over night… 6D62C3CC-4F56-4C3C-B0AA-6DDA14D7FE3C
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Has the dead 12v issue occurred for anybody *not* using connect app during the charging session? Or have all known instances been examples where connect app was used at some point during the charge session?
 

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I’m just going to leave this here in the hopes of giving people an insight as to where we are with this problem - I think Porsche might be in stage 3, but they are probably on stage 2 or 1.5. It’s probably safe to assume we’re a long ways off from stage 5…
This is depressing. I just left a deposit today! Keep us posted on your resolution. :fingerscrossed:
 

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Has the dead 12v issue occurred for anybody *not* using connect app during the charging session? Or have all known instances been examples where connect app was used at some point during the charge session?
I have never used the app and switched off all remote access in all my cars. I did have an issue where the car was 93% charged but told me the battery (12v) was dead, just after I had completed a 20min drive and parked up. I turned the car off for 20 mins and luckily it reset itself, but at the time it would not engage 1st gear.

that was before the new firmware, lets see if the problem comes back
 

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Has the dead 12v issue occurred for anybody *not* using connect app during the charging session? Or have all known instances been examples where connect app was used at some point during the charge session?
I hardly use the app when charging and was not using it the night my car died.
 

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I’m nervous as well about this problem happening at some point but then again it will be porsches problem and i don’t think i need to buy extra gear -chargers etc because of their problem. At very least they should give out the chargers for free until the problem is solved...
 


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Has the dead 12v issue occurred for anybody *not* using connect app during the charging session? Or have all known instances been examples where connect app was used at some point during the charge session?
'Connect App' ?..........not using Charging America app at the E.American stations?
 

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'Connect App' ?..........not using Charging America app at the E.American stations?
Some had reported dead 12v battery scenario after a charging session where they used the Porsche "Connect" app to check charging status, adjust charging timers/profiles etc during the charge session just prior to the dead 12v. I now see responses above where there are examples of dead 12v that had nothing to do with using the connect app.
 

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Porsche Taycan Car died over night… 1601372085114


@daveo4EV the above is a copy of your image in your post. I wonder why the Porsche charger seems to stop charging at some regular intervals? Are these stops linked to the 12 volt going bad?

Here is a screenshot of my charging the other night which was visible in myPorsche under domestic charging. It seems the car starts and stops the charger several times during the charging process. Are these stops perhaps linked to the 12 volt issue?? Does the car get into some kind of loop at these stages and can not get out of it?

Porsche Taycan Car died over night… Screenshot 2020-09-29 at 11.30.16
 
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@Scandinavian - good questions - with out access to the logs we don’t know why the vehicle sometime’s stops charging -but it’s an excellent observation.
 
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the service manager said something interesting yesterday regarding the 12V problem - it's a more subtle issue we're dealing with - it's not so much "draining" the 12V battery as for some reason the 12V is "tripping offline" for it's perceived safety - now one safety criteria is "low SOC" for a LiON battery - but that's not the only reason it can trip offline…there are other conditions that can cause this behavior…they should be uncommon and therefore not occur that often.

I'm going to speculate we're not being bitten by a "dead 12V" issue - we're being bitten by a power surge or some other power anomaly that causes the 12V to trip offline for "safety" reasons - when the 12V battery trips offline it is isolated from the rest of the car which shuts down all the other systems - and the car becomes a 5,100 lbs brick…

I find the following clues interesting but can not draw conclusions since I"m not an EE and don't know the specifciations/design of the systems involved other than in broad "it kinda has to work this way" fashion
  1. it seems to only happen while being charged
  2. it seems to happen while connected to the car via connect app
  3. it seems to happen after you've stopped using the connect app
  4. it seems to require a trivial amount of power to bring the system back
  5. and in my case I observed the battery voltage after it came alive and it was only above it's normal 13.4V for less than 2 minutes (which means the 12V wasn't that dead or even really dead at all)
  6. my battery was fine at 10:33 pm and dead by 11:33 pm - that's not a drain issue
I do not believe we are actually draining the 12V batteries - I believe there are potential power anomalies during the charging process that are causing some safety parameters to be tripped and the LiON 12V isolates itself from the rest of the car for it's own perceived "safety"

I believe the connect app is part of this problem because while the car is charging it sense a potential update from the connect portal (because you just used the connect app) and it's in the middle of a charging session - so it briefly pauses the charging session, looks at the new settings, and then immediately ramps the charging back up - a "blip" if you will int he charging session - well you are now blipping 240V/40AMPS worth of power - this is going to cause some electrical ripples throughout the vehicle's systems - a jolt if you will - and the LiON battery might detect this "jolt" and think it needs to trip it's safeties…cause there are some surges and dips happening in rapid succession…

when recovering the Taycan you are powering the entire vehicle (not the LiON battery directly) - the booster provides power to the vehicles entire 12V bus - which wakes up the vehicles main computer (because it now has power) and then the rest of the systems recover from this 'reset' caused by loss of power, and the LiON battery is not actually being "charged" - it's being allowed to reattach itself to the 12V bus because the system is rebooting - and it doesn't drop offline again because the conditions that caused it to isolate itself in the first placed are long since past…

at least in my case given the evidence and the conversation with the service manager - my 12V battery didn't go dead - it divorced itself from the vehicle due to conditions it considered dangerous to itself.

that's my theory for now…

we're not suffering with a 12V drain problem - we're dealing with an electrical fault that trips the 12V's safety disconnects - bricking the car - and it happens while the vehicle is plugged into external 240V/40 amp power - which has it's own potential issues and can be quite variable.
 
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TAYC4S

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So not sure how true this is and I certainly don’t want to jinx things (as my car is due in Oct/Nov) but, according to my OPC in the UK they have had no reported issues come through from Porsche GB (Great Britain) on any cars sold to date in the UK. As I said I am not sure if that’s actually true/correct but just sharing what I was told today...
 

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Dave so sorry to hear this is happening to your Taycan.

I have one Taycan client with a very early model of the Turbo S that has experienced this issue twice now.

Upon reading your first post I noticed this section of your log that caught my attention:

"I plugged into my 11 kW EVSE at 10:35 pm
Charging was cooking along at 10.5 kW at 10:39 pm with a target SOC of 85%
I verified charging was still working via Porsche connect app between 11 pm and 11:15 pm - then I went to sleep According to my home power monitoring the vehicle continued to charge until 11:22 pm - but by 11:36 pm it had stopped for some unknown reason - see picture"

The bolded text is what I personally have been contemplating is the issue going on here.

Our service team has found that the 12V battery has a "life" of about 15-20 minutes before it dies when running without the main battery charging it. It is surprising to me that between 21-36 minutes after you stopped using the Porsche Connect application that the 12V battery died.

I believe the issue to be with early production models of the Taycan, and the Porsche Connect application. It seems like something in the Connect application is leaving the 12V battery on.

Very frustrating for y'all as owners. I hope PAG and the Connect App engineers are working round the clock to come up with a resolution. With owners such as yourself helping out with detailed logs of what went on, I am hopeful we can have a full resolve here very soon.

I will do what I can as a salesman to continue to bug the piss out of Porsche to get quicker resolves for y'all. Obviously there is only so much I can do, and I hope I don't end up pissing anyone off at PAG or Porsche NA (I do really enjoy my job) - but there needs to be a more permanent resolve to this soon.
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