Does the new Apple Lossless Audio for Apple Music change your mind of getting Burmester?

ithinkmac

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I was on the thinking that what ever I'm playing/streaming will not make any difference, because compressed audio formats et all, now that Lossless is coming to Apple Music, is it a huge improvement with the Burmester upgrade? Anybody with the Burmester setup play with any FLAC files? What do you noticed? Or not noticed? Just curious, as my 4S CT order is not locked yet, and I want to see if this might be a worthwhile upgrade. Thanks all.

-ThinkMac-
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dgompper

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I was on the thinking that what ever I'm playing/streaming will not make any difference, because compressed audio formats et all, now that Lossless is coming to Apple Music, is it a huge improvement with the Burmester upgrade? Anybody with the Burmester setup play with any FLAC files? What do you noticed? Or not noticed? Just curious, as my 4S CT order is not locked yet, and I want to see if this might be a worthwhile upgrade. Thanks all.

-ThinkMac-
I had spec'd my 4S with the Burmester and converted my entire CD library to FLAC files. Glad I did - I had a 4S loaner last week with the Bose - gosh, what a difference between the two as well as mp3 vs. aiff vs. FLAC. I'll never go back.
 

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The Bluetooth protocol has technical limitations to the bit rate. The Burmester will not be able to take advantage of the higher bit rate offered by Apple or any other Hi-Res music provider, ie Tidal, Qobuz, etc.

As for FLAC files, the only way you might hear an appreciable difference is if your source is “hard wired” to your audio system.
 

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I had spec'd my 4S with the Burmester and converted my entire CD library to FLAC files. Glad I did - I had a 4S loaner last week with the Bose - gosh, what a difference between the two as well as mp3 vs. aiff vs. FLAC. I'll never go back.
If the source audio is the same then a FLAC and AIFF file will sound identical (this assumes a straight conversion of the file without any changes or processing of the audio).
 

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I was on the thinking that what ever I'm playing/streaming will not make any difference, because compressed audio formats et all, now that Lossless is coming to Apple Music, is it a huge improvement with the Burmester upgrade? Anybody with the Burmester setup play with any FLAC files? What do you noticed? Or not noticed? Just curious, as my 4S CT order is not locked yet, and I want to see if this might be a worthwhile upgrade. Thanks all.

-ThinkMac-
From Apple:

What you need to know about lossless in Apple Music
  • Streaming lossless audio over a cellular or Wi-Fi network consumes significantly more data. And downloading lossless audio uses significantly more space on your device. Higher resolutions use more data than lower ones.
  • AirPods, AirPods Pro, AirPods Max, and Beats wireless headphones use Apple AAC Bluetooth Codec to ensure excellent audio quality. However, Bluetooth connections aren't lossless.

Can I listen to lossless audio over Bluetooth?
We will deliver music using lossless audio compression to your iPhone, iPad, Mac, and Apple TV. Lossless will play back normally on Bluetooth speakers and headphones. However, Bluetooth connections don’t support lossless audio.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT212183

And you'll need a hard wired Digital Audio Converter (DAC) to really make the Burmester sing:

https://www.whathifi.com/us/news/ap...ssless-wont-work-on-iphone-airpods-or-homepod
 
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Scandinavian

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The Bluetooth protocol has technical limitations to the bit rate. The Burmester will not be able to take advantage of the higher bit rate offered by Apple or any other Hi-Res music provider, ie Tidal, Qobuz, etc.

As for FLAC files, the only way you might hear an appreciable difference is if your source is “hard wired” to your audio system.
I do not understand why you mix in Bluetooth here? As I have understood it, the Burmester system will play FLAC files that are stored on an USB device. And will happily play these in the car.

In the news from Apple, it states that you can download the music lossless to your iPhone. It will not play natively on the phone, but it should play it lossless if connected via a USB cable? Or? The phone will be seen as any other USB storage at that stage?

And the car has Apple Music in the PCM. Question is then if the PCM can download lossless music and buffer this and play through the Burmester?

Surely there must be some solution to make use of Lossless music from Apple in the car?
 
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ithinkmac

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That's what I'm assuming. Since Apple Music is built into PCM, it's not CarPlay anymore, I'm hoping because it's native and thus able to download lossless. I guess we'll know in a few more weeks.

-ThinkMac-


I do not understand why you mix in Bluetooth here? As I have understood it, the Burmester system will play FLAC files that are stored on an USB device. And will happily play these in the car.

In the news from Apple, it states that you can download the music lossless to your iPhone. It will not play natively on the phone, but it should play it lossless if connected via a USB cable? Or? The phone will be seen as any other USB storage at that stage?

And the car has Apple Music in the PCM. Question is then if the PCM can download lossless music and buffer this and play through the Burmester?

Surely there must be some solution to make use of Lossless music from Apple in the car?
 

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I do not understand why you mix in Bluetooth here? As I have understood it, the Burmester system will play FLAC files that are stored on an USB device. And will happily play these in the car.

In the news from Apple, it states that you can download the music lossless to your iPhone. It will not play natively on the phone, but it should play it lossless if connected via a USB cable? Or? The phone will be seen as any other USB storage at that stage?

And the car has Apple Music in the PCM. Question is then if the PCM can download lossless music and buffer this and play through the Burmester?

Surely there must be some solution to make use of Lossless music from Apple in the car?
I mentioned Bluetooth because most people incorrectly assume (myself included until I read up on the subject) that they can play Hi-Res audio files wirelessly via that protocol. Yes, your iPhone can store those Hi-Res audio files on its hard drive, and yes you can access and play those audio files via a wired connection. What's not clear to me is whether the Bose or even the Burmester can take advantage of those files for a superior audio experience. I have yet to see any published specs as to the audio capabilities of either system beyond the additional speakers available with the Burmester.
 

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I mentioned Bluetooth because most people incorrectly assume (myself included until I read up on the subject) that they can play Hi-Res audio files wirelessly via that protocol. Yes, your iPhone can store those Hi-Res audio files on its hard drive, and yes you can access and play those audio files via a wired connection. What's not clear to me is whether the Bose or even the Burmester can take advantage of those files for a superior audio experience. I have yet to see any published specs as to the audio capabilities of either system beyond the additional speakers available with the Burmester.
Oh ok. There has been a thread on this forum about lossless music and Burmester earlier, but I could not find it just now. I think the conclusion was that it was possible to play FLAC files on the Burmester if you had them on a USB stick or USB SSD drive. But I have very little knowledge about how good or what improvement it gives. Try to search here on the Forum.
 

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It will be interesting to see how Apple Car play delivers the audio. Bluetooth cannot play ALAC (lossless) without degrading the bitrate. I've seen conflicting reports online as to whether or not wireless car play can stream lossless bitrate.
 

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That's what I'm assuming. Since Apple Music is built into PCM, it's not CarPlay anymore, I'm hoping because it's native and thus able to download lossless. I guess we'll know in a few more weeks.

-ThinkMac-
I'll try to find the link I read, It claims that CarPlay is the same transfer protocol as AirPlay, which can supposedly handle lossless.
 

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It was my understanding that CarPlay uses wifi to transmit data, not bluetooth. So in theory, when Apple enables lossless audio, you can take advantage over CarPlay. I don't think we'll know the actual answer for a few weeks.

Here's a thread that discusses CarPlay and lossless audio that I found:
https://g05.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1748129
 

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For those still weighing the benefits of the Burmester vs. the Bose, this video might be helpful:
 

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Now that Apple has rolled this out -- will be trying this out with Burmester and CarPlay later tonight. Wonder if we'll ever get any definitive statements from Porsche and/or Apple on the built-in player. Porsche will prob not want to cover the increased data usage! This could be the end of me using it if so.
 
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