Good Test of ACC/ALK/Innodrive in Taycan

[whan]

Yep, remember there being a thread on it though I wonder if it may relate to the LCA option. Selecting innodrive on the UK configurator mandated the addition of LCA. Is it possible to FoD Innodrive on cars without LCA? If so that may be the sensor disparity postulated. I added LCA as absolutely wanted it, but wasn’t convinced on Innodrive so I’ll do the trial at some point.

Does UK Innodrive mandate LCA (Lane Change Assist, the light in your mirror that flashes), or ALK (Active Lane Keep, the one that keeps you centered in the lane and can follow curves)? Here, LCA is completely separate and unrelated. You don't need LCA to spec either Adaptive Cruise (ACC) or the ACC+ALK+InnoDrive bundle

In the US, when you order the car, you can either option Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC) which only controls speed while following another car, or ACC+ALK+Innodrive together as a bundle. What is interesting is that if you only option ACC from the factory, you can then add on ALK and Innodrive, but as separate individual pieces. ALK as mentioned before is the ability to follow the lanes and curves. Innodrive on the other hand does not provide ability to follow lanes - it instead adjusts the vehicle's speed in addition to ACC following, by using GPS data of curves and speed limits.

See below - in FoD, you purchase ALK and Innodrive functionality separately (unlike as a factory option where you get them together), and they have different descriptions

https://connect-store.porsche.com/us/en/p/active_lane_keeping_v1?model=taycan_2020

https://connect-store.porsche.com/us/en/p/inno_drive_v1?model=taycan_2020

From what I can understand, the Innodrive component doesn't seem to add that much value, and potentially even annoying as it adaptively changes your cruise control speed based on curves and speed even if no one is in front of you

The question is whether ALK when specced from the factory (as in the bundle) is better than FoD ALK. I too have heard it might be, but I personally am not convinced. That would imply that the factory option includes different hardware, but there's nothing in the option description that notes you get new hardware.

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[whan]

Just to add: I now see the confusion people have with what is included in "Innodrive". In the UK Configurator, the upgrade option is just called "Innodrive including ACC", and the description notes that it has Active Lane Keep functionality. BTW, it doesn't appear you need LCA when you select "Innodrive including ACC" in the UK Config

But in the US configurator, this option is instead called "InnoDrive incl. Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC) and Active Lane Keep (ALK)".

It seems Porsche is trying to separate ALK functionality from Innodrive given you can get them separately on FoD and that the US configurator lists them as separate components to the bundle option, but in the past they've been describing ALK as a subfunction of Innodrive (as it still is in the UK Configurator)

So for anyone reading, if you're trying to get the lane centering/following via FoD, you should be buying ALK, not Innodrive. For anyone who is optioning a car and wants ALK but doesn't care about the Innodrive speed regulation functions, you could save $550 by just optioning ACC and getting ALK via FoD (assuming the implementation of FoD ALK is the same as the factory option)

 

[DerekS]

Simplest explanations:

ACC: Active Cruise, keeps distance
ALK: Auto steering *when it can see the lane markers, can abort any time
LKA: Rumble strip sound and a slight nudge when you rub lanes
Innodrive: Auto speed changes

 

[batteredhaddock]

Just to add: I now see the confusion people have with what is included in "Innodrive". In the UK Configurator, the upgrade option is just called "Innodrive including ACC", and the description notes that it has Active Lane Keep functionality. BTW, it doesn't appear you need LCA when you select "Innodrive including ACC" in the UK Config

But in the US configurator, this option is instead called "InnoDrive incl. Adaptive Cruise Control (ACC) and Active Lane Keep (ALK)".

It seems Porsche is trying to separate ALK functionality from Innodrive given you can get them separately on FoD and that the US configurator lists them as separate components to the bundle option, but in the past they've been describing ALK as a subfunction of Innodrive (as it still is in the UK Configurator)

So for anyone reading, if you're trying to get the lane centering/following via FoD, you should be buying ALK, not Innodrive. For anyone who is optioning a car and wants ALK but doesn't care about the Innodrive speed regulation functions, you could save $550 by just optioning ACC and getting ALK via FoD (assuming the implementation of FoD ALK is the same as the factory option)

Sure when I was doing my configs it was saying needed to be added with LCA but there were so many done I may be misremembering it () or perhaps the logic has changed. Was just thinking the LCA was the only option that might add other hardware sensors that could benefit ALK/Innodrive.

Yep 100% can chose them separately and ALK is the one I might add as I did like the equivalent in the iPace. Don't think will bother with Innodrive, if it’s anything like the system in the ID3 I had it drove me mad. I prefer to chose my deceleration/acceleration points and then re-engage ACC thanks very much, and the amount of times it saw a 50 or 30 sign off the main road and flipped cruise from 75 to that value….

 

[f1eng]

Sure when I was doing my configs it was saying needed to be added with LCA but there were so many done I may be misremembering it () or perhaps the logic has changed. Was just thinking the LCA was the only option that might add other hardware sensors that could benefit ALK/Innodrive.

Yep 100% can chose them separately and ALK is the one I might add as I did like the equivalent in the iPace. Don't think will bother with Innodrive, if it’s anything like the system in the ID3 I had it drove me mad. I prefer to chose my deceleration/acceleration points and then re-engage ACC thanks very much, and the amount of times it saw a 50 or 30 sign off the main road and flipped cruise from 75 to that value….

So far I have yet to see an adaptive cruise control which drives like I do.
I used the normal cruise control all the time in my last car and am continually annoyed by the adaptive one I have now, so almost never use it.

The principle irritations are slowing way too early and way too much if driving keeping to the inside lane on the motorway then accelerating like crazy when pulling into the next lane.

It really only works OK in heavy traffic when staying in lane. Luckily that doesn't happen to me often.

As a result my inclination is to not option any extra cruise possibilities and stick to whatever comes as standard.

 

[Ross]

So far I have yet to see an adaptive cruise control which drives like I do.
I used the normal cruise control all the time in my last car and am continually annoyed by the adaptive one I have now, so almost never use it.

The principle irritations are slowing way too early and way too much if driving keeping to the inside lane on the motorway then accelerating like crazy when pulling into the next lane.

It really only works OK in heavy traffic when staying in lane. Luckily that doesn't happen to me often.

As a result my inclination is to not option any extra cruise possibilities and stick to whatever comes as standard.

Agree 100%
In my original Taycan 4S I used standard cruise a lot.
I have had 3 loaners with ACC including a 24hr drive.
All your problems and also way too sensitive on the braking if something pulls infront of you a mile up the road and if you nip out into the fast
lane just behind a car that has overtaken it slows with a jerk because car is close even though it is pulling away. Really got on my wick!
I have, cleverly, specced ACC on my GTS, which is now locked, just so I could play with ALK and Innodrive via FoD
From everything I have read on this forum after the 3 months free I might not bother at all.
My NEXT Taycan (always plan ahead!) will NOT have ACC

 

[f1eng]

From everything I have read on this forum after the 3 months free I might not bother at all.
My NEXT Taycan (always plan ahead!) will NOT have ACC

Useful to read that. I was in two minds about getting ACC to have the sensors now I will stick to standard.
I really have zero interest in any self driving aid in my car.

 

[Ross]

I wouldnt mind Active Lane Keeping via FoD but NOT if I have to spend £1100 on ACC I dont want!. Innodrive definitely not worth it after watching Out of Spec on You Tube.

I like that guy - seen a few of his videos. I prefer the ones when he leaves his Mrs at home!!

I quite like the friendly little nudge/rumble from the basic Lane Keep assist.
Combined with the basic Cruise and a little concentration that's all I need want!

 

[LonePalmBJ]

[Edit: My original post didn't mention LCA and was incorrect about LKA]

FWIW, here's my experience after 18 months with my '20 Taycan 4S with Innodrive, ACC, ALK, LCA and LKA

Innodrive: Virtually useless for me, and I leave it off more-or-less permanently. Where I live is flat, and the road trips I take generally involve largely straight highways with no significant curves. The 'feature' to auto-reset speed to posted speeds is unhelpful bordering on dangerous, and unlike what some have suggested above, there is no facility I'm aware of for Innodrive to set the speed limit to X mph or X% above posted speed.

Active Cruise Control (ACC): Extremely useful in both stop-and-go and highway cruising. Lowers driver workload and improves safety. Can easily adjust follow distance for conditions and preferences. ACC can be arbitrarily set to any speed, including significantly extra-legal (for the US) speeds.

Active Lane Keeping (ALK): I find that it works quite well. It's not perfect, but in general I find it does a very good job and is helpful again for both stop-and-go and highway cruising. Poor visibility conditions and poor lane markings do impact performance, so I use it most on well marked roads. I've never owned a Tesla but from all I gather it's not nearly as advanced as Autopilot or FSD, but that doesn't mean it isn't useful or worthwhile.

Lane Change Assist (LCA): It's simply blind-spot warnings with an indicator on the side mirrors when another vehicle may be in your blind spot. It's a safety system and I have no idea why it is a $950 USD fee-based option on a $100,000+ vehicle in the 2020s.

Lane Keep Assist (LKA): This seems to be the least understood by the layperson. It's simply lane deviation warnings and corrective inputs. It's a safety system and standard equipment on all Taycans. The traffic sign recognition and display, and the nav-based sharp curve warning displays, are nice to have but not overly useful to me. I do not auto-set ACC speed based on speed limit signs.


If I were spec'ing a new Taycan I would absolutely buy ACC, ALK, LKA and (begrudgingly) LCA again and not bother with Innodrive proper.

 

[KPZ]

Do we expect that they will improve the performance or capability of ALK/innodrive etc as the engineers address the issues and issue a update ?

 

[Indeo]

Do we expect that they will improve the performance or capability of ALK/innodrive etc as the engineers address the issues and issue a update ?

Ugh. I wouldn’t hold my breath. I have a 2017 Audi Q7 and some of the functionality that I see on the video is actually worse and certainly no better than my 5 yo vehicle. I am often surprised how well my vehicle reads speed limit signs and updates them on my dash. The video on the Taycan suggests this is much worse.

My ACC works reasonably, but is rather herky-jerky and not smooth, especially on braking, making my family complain that it makes them nauseous. One issue I frequently encounter is that the car doesn’t recognize then someone is turning into my lane, so it will gun the engine right up until the other vehicle is right in front of me and then slam the brakes. It also doesn’t recognize brake lights, so won’t get off the gas until sensors detect a sudden drop in distance and then bang, there go the brakes. This is even more of a concern if you drive fairly closely behind another vehicle as there is less room for error.

I don’t see that any of these issues have been improved in the video - sadly, in the last 5 years. Lane keeping is basically a ping pong activity so decent if you just got distracted for a second but not driving on its own. I don’t have ALK so cannot speak to that, but not great based on the video. And certainly not an activity where you can attend to anything else with any confidence that you won’t find yourself wrapped around a tree in 5 min time. And who purchased a Porsche to drive at the speed limit these days? So great that the Porsche Innodrive will let you hang there with the grandmothers in their Buicks, trailing at 55 mph as the Hyundais and Camrys zip by you at 70 mph. Way to go Porsche, that’s definitely worth an extra $24/month.

 

[Ross]

Lane Keep Assist: This seems to be the least understood by the layperson. It's simply lane deviation warnings and corrective inputs. It's a safety system and I have no idea why it is a fee-based option on a $100,000+ vehicle in the 2020s. The traffic sign recognition and display, and the nav-based sharp curve warning displays, are nice to have but not overly useful to me. I do not auto-set ACC speed based on speed limit signs either.



Its all hard to understand!
The terms are so close and confusing.
Lane KEEP Assist is exactly as you describe but is standard equipment on all Taycans
in US and UK markets, I havent checked other countries configurators!
Lane CHANGE Assist is optional.
The flashing lights in yr wing mirrors as proximity warning in surrounding lanes

 

[jasperp]

It is really ridiculous that other, cheaper cars in the Volkswagen group have better lane keeping software compared to the more expensive sub brands like Porsche.
It's like paying more and getting less. And not just getting less because it does not exist or because they do not have it, but because they have it and failed to manage it correctly.
Another minus one for Porsche.

I have Tesla and Porsche. I am still not sure which brand I like the most. My biggest problem with Porsche is that in different areas I have the feeling they do not really respect their customers the way it should.

 

[LonePalmBJ]

Lane KEEP Assist is exactly as you describe but is standard equipment on all Taycans
in US and UK markets, I havent checked other countries configurators!
Lane CHANGE Assist is optional.

Thanks. I updated my previous post.

 

[McgR]

Useful to read that. I was in two minds about getting ACC to have the sensors now I will stick to standard.
I really have zero interest in any self driving aid in my car.

I don’t know how it is with Porsche, I think it is similar. My past BMW’s had emergency braking included in the ACC functionality. It needs the ACC radar to be functional above 60 km/h. It has saved me from an accident two times the last 5 years. Driving too fast into a traffic jam and the car gave an emergency signal and after I initiated braking it did a full brake to stand still just preventing a collision. I know I should have payed better attention my self but still was very valuable.

Like mentioned by you and others. ACC works well for me on country roads just following the car in front. It doesn’t work well in heavy highway traffic because people behind me are irritated because the car leaves too much space, take over on the right, merge in front of me and the car brakes.

Following a car on the highway that has approximately the speed I want to travel my self also works well.

The high speed emergency braking function would is an important reason for me to option ACC.

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