Infrastructure Bill passed. I don’t think this is good.

[JGF]

Speculation is great, and no one knows what is going to happen, but…

Let's say, by some chance, the bill is delayed and leases early in 2022 are still offered with a $7500 capital cost reduction. That would allow a lessee to "lock in" the tax credit where as a purchase would come with significant uncertainty. Would anyone care the speculate on the efficacy of leasing followed by a buyout of the lease? Could any savings be realized in that scenario?

Without early termination penalties, my preliminary calculations indicate one could still realize most of the tax credit without the risk of an outright purchase. I'm not a finance guy. What am I missing?

Porsche Financial and any leasing company is fully aware, and will definitely build into the lease. Simplest is NO $7500 cap reduction, with a rebate after 4/1/2023 for a car leased in 2022 if is is not passed..

It will pass, and has plenty of time.

REMEMBER: Buy on 1/1/2022 get tax credit on 4/15/2023.

Only the union aspect of the EV portion is in ant serious contention.

---------------
``Sec. 36C. New qualified plug-in electric drive motor vehicles.''.

(e) Effective Dates.--

(1) The amendments made by subsections (a), (c), and (d) of this section shall apply to vehicles acquired after December 31, 2021.

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[whitex]

Without early termination penalties, my preliminary calculations indicate one could still realize most of the tax credit without the risk of an outright purchase. I'm not a finance guy. What am I missing?

$7,500 is a tax credit, and tax rules for 2022 can change until early 2023, before people file. If they think the car will not qualify under the new law, the leasing companies will either stop giving you the $7,500 credit, or put in something in the contract which will deal with the credit disappearing, something like "if the credit goes away, that will increase your residual value by $7,500 + interest", or "we will not give you the credit right now, but if your car ends up still eligible in 2023, we'll credit you $7,500 or reduce your monthly payment by $X amount for the remainder of the lease". Leasing companies can get creative, for example Tesla leasing used to just add the $7,500 credit back to the residual value at the very end, even though they got the credit, so if you did buy out the car at the end, you only got to save interest on $7,500 , but if you returned the car, you got the benefit of the full $7,500 + interest.

 

[RingoDingo]

They intended to make the capital gains tax increase retroactive to the moment the plan was first publicized, specifically to prevent people from realizing gains prior to the passage of the increase.

EV tax credits and capital gains taxes are very different in a lot of ways, so making the latter retroactive doesn't imply the former will be too. But in a sense, the seal has been broken, which makes it a smaller step to make other types of increases retroactive as well.

This has nothing to do with reasonableness or fairness, of course. But the tax code's got nothing to do with reasonableness or fairness either.

which would have been bullshit because there were a lot of insiders with powerful lobbyists (including some VC funds i know) who were getting tipped off about what “might” be announced and then took actions in response to that inside information even still.

but I agree with you - not the same tax avoidance considerations.

 

[Mr.Smith]

Manchin says he will not vote for Build Back Better: 'This is a no'

 

[Prit]

Manchin says he will not vote for Build Back Better: 'This is a no'

The question is - if folks get their Taycan after 12/31/21, and the bill passes some time later, will it be retroactive till Jan 1, 2022 and disqualify those folks from the credit? Who knows.. it will likely be more costly to make it retroactive as Tesla sales will pad the cost so hopefully any passed bill takes effect from date of signing.

 

[Mr.Smith]

The question is - if folks get their Taycan after 12/31/21, and the bill passes some time later, will it be retroactive till Jan 1, 2022 and disqualify those folks from the credit? Who knows.. it will likely be more costly to make it retroactive as Tesla sales will pad the cost so hopefully any passed bill takes effect from date of signing.

It looks like it's dead, period.

 

[Bella]

It looks like it's dead, period.

May be bad news if the Stock Market reacts negatively Monday. We may lose a lot more than $7500 next week.

 

[PanameraFrank]

You know if someone says something on Twitter or Fox News that it's 100% true and they won't change their mind later. ...

This could very well just be a power play.

 

[Tooney]

"No man's life, liberty or property are safe while the Legislature is in session."
--- Saying quoted by Gideon J. Tucker, Surrogate, in 1866 report of the final accounting in the estate of A. B. New York Surrogate Reports, 1 Tucker (N. Y. Surr.) 249 (1866).

 

[kort]

You know if someone says something on Twitter or Fox News that it's 100% true and they won't change their mind later. ...

This could very well just be a power play.

is cnn the source for unbiased information?

 

[Tooney]

is cnn the source for unbiased information?

Of course not, @kort .
It is MSNBC.
See on Ford F-150 Lightning.

 

[Mr.Smith]

You know if someone says something on Twitter or Fox News that it's 100% true and they won't change their mind later. ...

This could very well just be a power play.

If this starts again in 2022, the Bill will need to be rewritten and will probably be for 2023.

 

[Artman]

If this starts again in 2022, the Bill will need to be rewritten and will probably be for 2023.

 

[mdrobc1213]

May be bad news if the Stock Market reacts negatively Monday. We may lose a lot more than $7500 next week.

He's a politician...Nothing they say or have said is written in stone most of the time. Just as Machin gave his "word" to support the framework and now opposes it circumstance may cause it to reverse again. Sad part is stock market may take a hit for the short term tho and the fact that the folks up there cannot get along an compromise worth a dayum on anything is just sad. 100% winners vs losers is NOT what its supposed to be all about...SAD!

At least I'll get my $5800 on my wife's BMW hybrid purchase last Sept. for sure!

 

[Mr.Smith]

More good news

Manchin’s $1.8 trillion spending offer appears no longer to be on the table

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