Chris8536

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No offense, but sorry, I don't believe you. If what you are saying is true I'm sure there would have been a newsworthy article somewhere that mentioned bribes from Porsche to prevent a safety issue being reported.
Believe what you want it’s in this forum even

here is an example of the offer: https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/major-issues-with-taycan-turbo-s.5329/post-76175

it is ostensibly for “time and inconvenience” but also has a clause that you don’t share to talk about it.
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gnop1950

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Believe what you want it’s in this forum even

here is an example of the offer: https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/major-issues-with-taycan-turbo-s.5329/post-76175

it is ostensibly for “time and inconvenience” but also has a clause that you don’t share to talk about it.
None of those say anything about not talking about it. In fact, each of them says that if the problem occurs again it will still be covered under warranty (they couldn't reproduce the problem so marked it fixed). Nothing out of the norm in that thread I could find. The OP of the linked thread later stated:

I have an update for this issues, this is nothing to do with Taycan. I hit some debris on the free way where there was construction that knocked of cooling system hoses and leaked all the coolant that caused this issue. It took a month for the dealer to get the parts and now it is all fine.

Thanks,
Pratap Alluri
 

Chris8536

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None of those say anything about not talking about it. In fact, each of them says that if the problem occurs again it will still be covered under warranty (they couldn't reproduce the problem so marked it fixed). Nothing out of the norm in that thread I could find. The OP of the linked thread later stated:
Sure but the offer was made. It happens. It happened to me.

Look I know for some reason your unhappy about this issue but you shouldn’t be trying to correct people who went through this with a car you don’t even own yet.

It’s over now, Porsche was a knob about it and acted unprofessionally. Sorry to burst your bubble.
 

gnop1950

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Sure but the offer was made. It happens. It happen to me.
There is a huge difference between offering compensation for time and inconvenience for a problem that the dealer is unable to recreate, or in the case of the OP in that thread where it took a month to get the parts, and a cover-up bribe to not talk about a known problem.

I actually look at it as a plus that they were willing to offer compensation even though from their perspective there wasn't a problem.

Perhaps I'm more understanding since I worked in the software industry for over 40 years and know firsthand how difficult software problems can be to reproduce, isolate, and fix. I almost wish I could get my fingers into the code for my new Porsche, but that would most certainly be a safety violation.
 

Chris8536

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There is a huge difference between offering compensation for time and inconvenience for a problem that the dealer is unable to recreate, or in the case of the OP in that thread where it took a month to get the parts, and a cover-up bribe to not talk about a known problem.

I actually look at it as a plus that they were willing to offer compensation even though from their perspective there wasn't a problem.

Perhaps I'm more understanding since I worked in the software industry for over 40 years and know firsthand how difficult software problems can be to reproduce, isolate, and fix. I almost wish I could get my fingers into the code for my new Porsche, but that would most certainly be a safety violation.
Did your software send a car full if your family into a dead roll on the cliff side of highway 1? Because that’s what this sloppy updating of code did to me.

it was an effing bad software shop doing sloppy work. They didn’t know the basics of systems control and failure handling. Myself and my coworker are somewhat influential in the software world and back channeled with the shop. Very inexperienced methods, shotty QA etc and our contact there openly shared that with us. The remote app was being hosted off a single server they had onsite. Embarrassing stuff from a hardware company that knows crap all about dev and was arrogant enough not to pay for the right experience.

this is coming from someone who designs software for billions of people who use it daily. If your code involves peoples safety, you do a fucking better job. You do it right.
 

gnop1950

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Did your software send a car full if your family into a dead roll on the cliff side of highway 1? Because that’s what this sloppy updating of code did to me.

it was an effing bad software shop doing sloppy work. They didn’t know the basics of systems control and failure handling. Myself and my coworker are somewhat influential in the software world and back channeled with the shop. Very inexperienced methods, shotty QA etc and our contact there openly share that with us. The remote app was being hosted off a single server they had onsite. Embarrassing stuff from a hardware company that knows crap all about dev and was arrogant enough not to pay for the right experience.
Software issues, and design issues, are rampant in the auto industry, and not just the auto industry. It is unfortunate that you encountered the issue you did, but it really isn't any worse than any number of other safety issues that have come up over the years. How about exploding airbags, or Tesla's emergency stopping in traffic, or, ...., you get the idea.

It would be great if all software issues could be resolved prior to the release of the software, but I don't believe that will ever happen.

While I understand you being upset and wouldn't think of telling you that you shouldn't be. I only took issue with the idea that there was some sort of conspiracy to cover up the problem. I still think that Porsche's response was timely and appropriate.
 

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From looking at their various mobile apps and in-car implementations - it would appear that software in general isn't a Porsche strong point. Thankfully they still make great cars - just need them to up their software game :)
Did your software send a car full if your family into a dead roll on the cliff side of highway 1? Because that’s what this sloppy updating of code did to me.

it was an effing bad software shop doing sloppy work. They didn’t know the basics of systems control and failure handling. Myself and my coworker are somewhat influential in the software world and back channeled with the shop. Very inexperienced methods, shotty QA etc and our contact there openly shared that with us. The remote app was being hosted off a single server they had onsite. Embarrassing stuff from a hardware company that knows crap all about dev and was arrogant enough not to pay for the right experience.

this is coming from someone who designs software for billions of people who use it daily. If your code involves peoples safety, you do a fucking better job. You do it right.
Given the quality of their mobile solutions, and seemingly buggy firmware - definitely feels like they need to up their software game. They definitely have the hardware nailed.

My team has had to deal with many hardware supply chain issues that has resulted in many required software updates to accommodate alternative hardware component selection - I wonder if some of what we are seeing on the newer models is a result of rapid course change as they also source alternative hardware components with insufficient test time.
 

gnop1950

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...
this is coming from someone who designs software for billions of people who use it daily. If your code involves peoples safety, you do a fucking better job. You do it right.
If you are telling me that you are designing and releasing any complex piece of software that is bug-free, please let me know what it is and what your test suite looks like. In all my years of developing/testing/using software, I have yet to see this perfect solution and it would make my day to finally get a look at it.

Look, if you want to pull out the mine is bigger than yours argument, fine, but that wouldn't be very productive. After all, this is an internet forum. I could tell you have I have multiple degrees, including a Doctorate in Computer Science, have written many thousands of lines of code, and maintained and debugged millions of lines of code. But so what? Anyone could claim the same.

But if you are really that good, talk to Porsche. Software engineers are needed all over and if you can fix their coding/testing practices and ensure perfect software I'm sure they'd be interested.

But peace, out, I think we've about exhausted this topic.
 

Chris8536

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If you are telling me that you are designing and releasing any complex piece of software that is bug-free, please let me know what it is and what your test suite looks like. In all my years of developing/testing/using software, I have yet to see this perfect solution and it would make my day to finally get a look at it.

Look, if you want to pull out the mine is bigger than yours argument, fine, but that wouldn't be very productive. After all, this is an internet forum. I could tell you have I have multiple degrees, including a Doctorate in Computer Science, have written many thousands of lines of code, and maintained and debugged millions of lines of code. But so what? Anyone could claim the same.

But if you are really that good, talk to Porsche. Software engineers are needed all over and if you can fix their coding/testing practices and ensure perfect software I'm sure they'd be interested.

But peace, out, I think we've about exhausted this topic.
I think you’d be familiar with releasing software with P3 cosmetic and annoying bugs vs p0 bugs that can kill people. Planes fly every day with control systems with error rates millions of times less than 0.7! Don’t falsely equivocate if you are so experienced in the field.
 

gnop1950

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I think you’d be familiar with releasing software with P3 bugs vs p0 bugs that can kill people. Don’t falsely equivocate if you are so experienced in the field.
You are talking about known bugs versus unknown bugs. That is completely different from unknown bugs, which every major piece of software has. If you are claiming that you are releasing software where every bug has been identified, and there are no unknown bugs that ever show up, call me skeptical.

“There are two ways of constructing a software design. One way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies. And the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies.” - C.A.R. Hoare
 
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HawkBlitz

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Did your software send a car full if your family into a dead roll on the cliff side of highway 1? Because that’s what this sloppy updating of code did to me.

it was an effing bad software shop doing sloppy work. They didn’t know the basics of systems control and failure handling. Myself and my coworker are somewhat influential in the software world and back channeled with the shop. Very inexperienced methods, shotty QA etc and our contact there openly shared that with us. The remote app was being hosted off a single server they had onsite. Embarrassing stuff from a hardware company that knows crap all about dev and was arrogant enough not to pay for the right experience.

this is coming from someone who designs software for billions of people who use it daily. If your code involves peoples safety, you do a fucking better job. You do it right.
I just find it hard to believe that in this age of cloud computing someone would run a service off a single server onsite. Agree, they are a hardware company but have tie-ups with large scale software companies who would be more than happy to collaborate with architects to come up with highly available services. Given your influence in the software world did you help their software division leadership with right guidance?
 

EVer

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This is a post on another thread, relevant to this one. I have a 2022 RWD, build date in Oct 2021.
Well to those who have followed this thread, I have to report that I once again had a serious issue. I was coasting to a light at a slow speed and I think the car jerked to a stop on its own and then lost all power to the motor. I got all kinds of error messages on the front screen. I managed to take a picture of one below. I was finally able to move again after shutting the car off (button to left of steering wheel) and then was able to put the car in drive and got no more error messages for the mile or so to my home. I called my service advisor and left a message but there IS something wrong with my car though Porsche said they could not find anything after last time when they had it a week. I’m now feeling uncomfortable frankly about driving it.

BAACBEA7-0550-4B59-A40F-8E7331C61943.jpeg
 

RCorsa

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Not sure but this sounds like a different issue but similar to 12v issues from last year.? My 2021 4s is exactly a year old with 7800 miles and never a single issue except the two software updates done. Tonight I got this error and car won’t charge. Tried shutting it down leaving it and trying again. Same result. Tried two different chargers and both charging ports. All I get is this error.

DB223CE0-1901-48DD-8B71-02B07267E88F.jpeg
 

charliemathilde

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Believe what you want it’s in this forum even

here is an example of the offer: https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/major-issues-with-taycan-turbo-s.5329/post-76175

it is ostensibly for “time and inconvenience” but also has a clause that you don’t share to talk about it.
only on the internet would someone claim a dealer offering point blank to buy the car back and replace it with a new one, or refund them, as somehow failing to take responsibility or sweeping the issue under the rug.

she had a lemon, she got taken care of.
 
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