daveo4EV

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When the Ossiaco inverter/charger launches you’ll be able to easily turn your vehicle into a backup home generator to keep your essential appliances running
this all started when you said ”it’s easy” - see your quote

I said no it’s not - and provided details as to how the Ossiaco product is insufficient to the task - it can not infact do what it says with out substaintial rework of 100% of the residential homes in North America - and bi-directional charging support from vehicle manufactures (no manufacturers to date have annouced this support in a production/shipping automobile - saying we’ll do it in the ‘future’ does not count)

you said you don’t understand - this is clear - you don’t understand.
I’m not exactly sure what you’re saying because the technical details are not my domain
and now you’re saying yeah it may not happen for a while but isn’t it cool if it were to happen
  • well it’s not easy
  • it’s not happening anytime soon
  • and no one has any actual products anyone can buy that does this - and not one has any annouced schedule for products you can actual purchase to do this
  • please list the vehicles on the market today or near future where this is supported?
so it’s not easy, it’s actually hard. It’s all possible, but possible is not a product and I’m not sure what you are saying, other than wouldn’t it be cool if there was a pony that could power my home?
EVs alone are a long way from mass adoption. You could argue vehicle ownership is becoming more and more obsolete. I’m not sure what you’re trying to say, but for some, this should be technically feasible. Nobody is saying it will be a universal thing just like EVs are still a niche product.
  • great we agree this is technically feasible - but that’s been clear for years and or decades
  • it is not in fact easy because of installed base of homes that require substaintial and costly reworking of their residential power systems to accommodate this
  • it’s not happening soon because EV’s are a niche product
  • Porsche proably isn’t going to focus on this cause they’ve got so many other things on their plate
  • other EV manufacture’s have suggested they would like to do this but have no concrete plans to offer these services/features at this time since they lack dates/products or even actual cars for sale?
and you want to have this general conversation on a Taycan forum discussing how a taycan in Texas was used to charge a phone with the 12V power adapter - a 50 year old technology that will still be with us 50 years from now, because change is hard.

got it.

this all started cause you said “this is easy” - it is in fact not easy - nothing dealing with installed based legacy building codes is easy - and integration with electrical grids is notoriously difficult and regulation driven…

it is possible to power your home with an EV - but it’s neither easy, and as of today there is not a single EV product in the market that can do this - and so far no announced products with any future shipping date.

great - lots of things are possible - should we talk about the possibility of human’s living on mars? That is also possible.





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JimBob

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Just to be aware. You might void your warranty doing some of these things.

 

daveo4EV

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Just to be aware. You might void your warranty doing some of these things.

and bi-directional charging support from vehicle manufactures (no manufacturers to date have annouced this support in a production/shipping automobile - saying we’ll do it in the ‘future’ does not count)
ummm - yeah - it's not easy.
 
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when I talked to the OSSIACO people - I asked if their "Tempo" technology was the "cut-off" to isolate the home from the grid - they replied "no" - and that they do not intend to isolate the home from the grid even during an outage

I'm not an expert and I might be wrong - but having done solar for over 15 years, and home power generation (generators & batteries for at least 5 years) - it's my understanding grid-isolation is a requirement for all residential home _IF_ you intend to use your generation sources during grid outage…we'll see…

they have the correct drawing - you just need a cut off switch between the "utility grid" and "breaker panel" - that unfortunately is part of the "expensive" part of any home backup solution…

Tesla is the closest to doing this - they have:
  • over a million batteries (vehicles) with software they control
    • firmware update to allow "back feed" power…???
  • wifi controlled home EV chargers to "enable/disable" vehicle to home power
    • the EVSE is just a switch - all EVSE's to date are one way (home to car) - wanna bet the Gen3 wall chargers can do bidirectional with a firmware update?
    • Gen3 Tesla Wall Chargers have wifi, firmware, and are 60 amps
    • seems like an easy software up date to have these "talk" to a Powerwall gateway
    • 60 amp back feed is 12 kW of power to the home…more than enough during an outage
  • Powerwall gateways which can do the necessary orchestration
    • Tesla already has experience and the device in production and in the field doing this - and they control the firmware of that device also…
  • Tesla already has "some" control over not charging the EV unless there is surplus power when on battery power (disconnected from the grid)
    • this is an existing shipping feature for Tesla vehicles & Powerwall customers - don't charge my Tesla if my batteries are "below 75%"...

Screen Shot 2021-02-23 at 10.54.53 AM.png


I estimate 7 years…this will be a thing - 2 year for the Tesla fleet - and they will be selling their installed base "Powerwall" gateways, Tesla Gen3 wall chargers - but no Powerwall batteries - just use your car as the battery - Tesla is having trouble providing residential batteries anyways - big back log - just use their cars which they are churring out at like 450,000 units a year…

Tesla is the closest to having a commercial system that could actually work - since they control all the moving parts - vertical integration for the win.

I'm thinking a $4999 "home energy" upgrade for Model 3/Model Y owner - where Tesla installs a Powerwall gateway, 1 or 2 Gen2 WiFi chargers and then you can "enable" home backup on your Model 3/Model Y is a pretty good service/upgrade…Tesla can almost do it today - and their customers would line up to give them $5000 for this feature - especially in California/Texas given recent experience.


I have a Solar Edge whole house backup scenario...2 batteries and 44 solar panels....So I am ready.. In NV they told me that the Powerwall cant charge off the grid. Thats why I went with Solar Edge and LG Batteries as its charged from my panels and or the grid
 

mnichols

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they work fine - but you have to install a grid-cut-off switch if you intend to use them with your grid-tied home - if you are powering your home with ANY source of power (generator/battery) and you do not disconnect yourself from the grid while it’s down - most utitlity companies frown on that type of setup - and it’s dangerous to the workers, and the neighborhood’s power demands will overwhelm your power source causing it to brown out…

the real cost of these system is reworking the average residential home to have this cut off…

Hyundai’s V2L is an ac outlet in the car that you can use to power things - it’s not powering your home.



it’s not just a matter of plugging your EV into your home with a bi-directional charger - you must REWORK the home’s entire electrical system to support this

Lucid is not shipping any products - talk to me when you can actually purchase a vehicle and someone’s done this with their residential home built in the 1970’s, 1980’s or really ever…

I don’t know about europe - but in north america 99.9999% percent of residential homes will need to spend at least a few thousand $$$ to rework their electical system to have an automatic cut off switch…there is NO plug & play solution - and a bi-directional charger is just one part of the puzzel but not the entire solution.

now AC power from the car that you can plug things into - that’s great, easy, fun and so forth - but that’s not powering your HOME - that’s powering devices you choose to plug into your car.
Gosh, don't know about the $2,000 cost to rework the power system of a house, but for $75 and an hours worth of time, we have a cutout plate on our electrical box. To enable the external power input breaker, you must first move the main breakers to off, which allows the external power breaker to be turned on. Fool proof for back charging the grid, with this system it can't be done and doesn't cost a lot of dollars.
 

feye

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Porsche's customer research might have concluded: Why need any of this, our customers don't live in places with blackouts!
 

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