Scared to ask... anyone tempted by Model S Plaid?

[Artman]

I appreciate the better space utilization of the model s. Given similar dimensions, they somehow manage more passenger/cargo/storage room than say a cross turismo. In pics I think I might prefer the airier interior design as well as maybe the better UI (except the yoke wheel of course).

The issues I have with Tesla is they seem to lack a culture of safety and I can’t bear the thought of giving Elon musk any money.

so for roughly 15k more out the door I’ll get a cross turismo that looks better, and has some features unavailable on the Tesla like massage seats, carplay and surround view cameras. I’ll also give up some acceleration but I’m ok with that. Plus I’ll get a car that’s screwed together by people with lots of experience doing that. Seems like a worthwhile trade off.

Not to mention the handling!

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[Mouse House]

COVID is a mess all-around....been trying to get a new infinity pool installed for over a year and current estimates are 2-years out for completion of build.
This is what happens when we shut down the world economy and cost-savings measures need to go into play, when the demand-side opens up, you are still dealing with a perfect storm of supply chain gaps coming to market right when the there is the highest need. I expect that this will be in effect through 2022, and not until 2023 will we see things get back to 'normal' supply/demand curves.

Oh no, not the infinity pool!

 

[TycanNewHampshire]

you can delete the word infinity if that makes you hate your neighbor less. Just getting any one is is taking 2+ years. I have worked through all vacations for 3-years and this is my investment in my vacation. Your sarcasm is toxic.

I used to work in Geneva(e), and you don't have it so bad, 4-5 weeks guaranteed vacation.....I haven't seen that in years in the U.S.. apologies if the time I have off, I want to spend with my family relaxing. Hope your snarky little 4th grade comments makes you feel better about your life. You are a wonderful and loving world-citizen and positive representation of the human race......

 

[Henke]

I appreciate the better space utilization of the model s. Given similar dimensions, they somehow manage more passenger/cargo/storage room than say a cross turismo. In pics I think I might prefer the airier interior design as well as maybe the better UI (except the yoke wheel of course).

The issues I have with Tesla is they seem to lack a culture of safety and I can’t bear the thought of giving Elon musk any money.

so for roughly 15k more out the door I’ll get a cross turismo that looks better, and has some features unavailable on the Tesla like massage seats, carplay and surround view cameras. I’ll also give up some acceleration but I’m ok with that. Plus I’ll get a car that’s screwed together by people with lots of experience doing that. Seems like a worthwhile trade off.

Not sure if you’ve had the opportunity to sit in a Tesla or go on a long drive. Comfort is maybe a 4 versus a 9 or 10 for the Porsche. That’s before you start driving the thing. I made the mistake of test driving the Taycan with no intention to buy for a few years. It only took about 5 mins of the test drive to realise I needed to make a change.

 

[XLR82XS]

Not sure if you’ve had the opportunity to sit in a Tesla or go on a long drive. Comfort is maybe a 4 versus a 9 or 10 for the Porsche. That’s before you start driving the thing. I made the mistake of test driving the Taycan with no intention to buy for a few years. It only took about 5 mins of the test drive to realise I needed to make a change.

Agreed. Taycan is worlds more comfortable than my Tesla. (I'm 6' 3")

 

[B61]

Even for in-out?
(i’m 6’4”)

 

[Vim Schrotnock]

The contrast between Plaid and Taycan brings up an interesting question - when is a 0-60 time not really a 0-60 time? I believe if you require 10 minutes to 'warm up' the car, then the resulting sub 2-second 0-60 time is almost meaningless. The only time you'll ever realize this time is at a dragstrip, or some special 'moment' where you decide to do a 0-60 run and have the time and safe space to do so. You're certainly not realizing this capability in normal driving. That's really my point - if you can't access a feature of the car in normal driving, is it really a feature that you can benefit from?

Certainly the Plaid Tesla will be quicker than the Taycan in a number of scenarios, and possibly in normal driving. My question here is; do we really want to go down the road of ever-reducing 0-60 times for EV's? Once you get into the 2 second range, I would say you're in the territory of diminishing returns. Certainly if all other things are equal, I want the faster car. But after driving my Turbo S for almost 10K miles, I can say that I don't need or want anything faster. The ability to do a 9 second quarter mile is amazing, but at any track that I can access, I'll need a roll-cage and other safety items to even run. And I can't experience this '9 second acceleration' unless I warm the car up for 10 minutes, and there is nowhere I could run on public roads.

I can honestly say I almost never go 100% throttle, and even more rarely launch control. I'm doing it less and less because the violence and disruption is actually counter to the character of the car in 99% of driving. I much prefer to enjoy the instant response and feel of the car in a smoother and more engaging way.

I believe we are in the 'shiny new toy' phase of EV's and are enamored with their incredible torque and response. In another few years, when Model 3's are running 2 second 0-60 times, I don't think we'll be as focused on this metric.

 

[cfp]

The contrast between Plaid and Taycan brings up an interesting question - when is a 0-60 time not really a 0-60 time? I believe if you require 10 minutes to 'warm up' the car, then the resulting sub 2-second 0-60 time is almost meaningless. The only time you'll ever realize this time is at a dragstrip, or some special 'moment' where you decide to do a 0-60 run and have the time and safe space to do so. You're certainly not realizing this capability in normal driving. That's really my point - if you can't access a feature of the car in normal driving, is it really a feature that you can benefit from?

Agreed. And I know 0-60 gets the headlines but the 60-130 mph times that Plaid posts are what's interesting to me. Seems like that car pulls all the way into mid-triple digits.

 

[manitou202]

The acceleration of the older Model S Performance, the Plaid, the Taycan Turbo, and Turbo S is basically unusable for anything other than showing off or on a race track. Obviously a lot of people will pay serious money to simply show off, so I'm sure a lot of buyers will buy one simply for bragging rights. In terms of track use, these cars are great for the drag strip and that's about it. There isn't a single EV available that is great road track car. Yes the Model 3P and the Taycan are fun to drive on a road track, and can handle a handful of laps, but I would take any 911 or Cayman for track day events over an EV.

As someone else pointed out on another forum, the $50k delta between the base Model S and the Plaid, gives you about 1 second faster acceleration to 60mph, apparently bigger brakes, torque vectoring, and a carbon fiber spoiler. That's a lot of money for those upgrades. Then factor in your only options for the Plaid are 5 exterior colors, 3 interior colors, 2 wheels, and FSD, it starts to look more like a Toyota than a luxury car. The number of luxury features missing or unavailable for a $100k+ vehicle is quite large. I still believe the Taycan and Model S are only viewed as competitors because they are both EVs. If 10 other $100k+ EV sedans were available we wouldn't be having this discussion.

I'm already thinking about my next Taycan (Cross Turismo) and I'll probably end up with a 4S or Turbo version. I love my Turbo S and don't regret buying for one second, but I don't need the crazy acceleration and I'll probably save a few bucks next time around.

If I was seriously considering a Tesla Model S, the base version is a no brainer. It's faster than most road cars, looks good and has reasonable luxury for an $80k car. The range is outstanding and they have the best charging network at the moment. The biggest reason not to consider a Plaid, isn't the Taycan, it's the base Model S.

 

[XLR82XS]

The contrast between Plaid and Taycan brings up an interesting question - when is a 0-60 time not really a 0-60 time? I believe if you require 10 minutes to 'warm up' the car, then the resulting sub 2-second 0-60 time is almost meaningless. The only time you'll ever realize this time is at a dragstrip, or some special 'moment' where you decide to do a 0-60 run and have the time and safe space to do so. You're certainly not realizing this capability in normal driving. That's really my point - if you can't access a feature of the car in normal driving, is it really a feature that you can benefit from?

I believe we are in the 'shiny new toy' phase of EV's and are enamored with their incredible torque and response. In another few years, when Model 3's are running 2 second 0-60 times, I don't think we'll be as focused on this metric.

Agreed. In the coming years the focus will be on overall build quality/overall product and not 0-60. In today's world who cares if you're car has 2 second 0-60 time. It's a juvenile pissing match over .1/.2 of a second.

 

[Mr.Smith]

The acceleration of the older Model S Performance, the Plaid, the Taycan Turbo, and Turbo S is basically unusable for anything other than showing off or on a race track. Obviously a lot of people will pay serious money to simply show off, so I'm sure a lot of buyers will buy one simply for bragging rights. In terms of track use, these cars are great for the drag strip and that's about it. There isn't a single EV available that is great road track car. Yes the Model 3P and the Taycan are fun to drive on a road track, and can handle a handful of laps, but I would take any 911 or Cayman for track day events over an EV.

As someone else pointed out on another forum, the $50k delta between the base Model S and the Plaid, gives you about 1 second faster acceleration to 60mph, apparently bigger brakes, torque vectoring, and a carbon fiber spoiler. That's a lot of money for those upgrades. Then factor in your only options for the Plaid are 5 exterior colors, 3 interior colors, 2 wheels, and FSD, it starts to look more like a Toyota than a luxury car. The number of luxury features missing or unavailable for a $100k+ vehicle is quite large. I still believe the Taycan and Model S are only viewed as competitors because they are both EVs. If 10 other $100k+ EV sedans were available we wouldn't be having this discussion.

I'm already thinking about my next Taycan (Cross Turismo) and I'll probably end up with a 4S or Turbo version. I love my Turbo S and don't regret buying for one second, but I don't need the crazy acceleration and I'll probably save a few bucks next time around.

If I was seriously considering a Tesla Model S, the base version is a no brainer. It's faster than most road cars, looks good and has reasonable luxury for an $80k car. The range is outstanding and they have the best charging network at the moment. The biggest reason not to consider a Plaid, isn't the Taycan, it's the base Model S.

Playing devils advocate. What made you initially get the Turbo S over a Turbo or 4S?

 

[rich_r]

Agreed. In the coming years the focus will be on overall build quality/overall product and not 0-60. In today's world who cares if you're car has 2 second 0-60 time. It's a juvenile pissing match over .1/.2 of a second.

Let’s hope so. Tesla seems to have “inspired” some bad trends in the auto industry including this over focus on 0-60 times. Credit to them for playing to their strengths but it’s getting ridiculous.

 

[manitou202]

Playing devils advocate. What made you initially get the Turbo S over a Turbo or 4S?

I originally was going to custom order a Turbo with an MSRP of around $175k. It was going to be 5 months for delivery and my dealer wasn't willing to negotiate on the price. This was August of 2020.

They had a brand new Turbo S that the customer decided not to take delivery on, and they were willing to give me a decent discount. This brought the price difference between the Turbo and Turbo S to around $12k, and I was able to take delivery immediately. So I ended up with the Turbo S.

 

[rich_r]

Not sure if you’ve had the opportunity to sit in a Tesla or go on a long drive. Comfort is maybe a 4 versus a 9 or 10 for the Porsche. That’s before you start driving the thing. I made the mistake of test driving the Taycan with no intention to buy for a few years. It only took about 5 mins of the test drive to realise I needed to make a change.

I haven’t taken long drives in one but have sat In model 3s and various iterations of pre refresh model s. I agree that none of them felt particularly good. For me personally, the biggest deal breaker with teslas from a comfort perspective are the mandatory fake leather seats. They make me start sweating in a matter of 15 minutes. I will never buy any car with that type of seat covering. I even returned a rental Passat once and swapped for something else cause it had fake leather. I’m fine with other synthetic options like cloth,Alcantara ,etc. I dont have that issue with real leather (even the cheap corrected grain stuff you find in 3 series, etc).


putting that aside, I suppose it’s possible that they’ve improved the comfort of the post refresh model s seats (not sure if anyone here has actually sat in one yet).

 

[JustLooking]

Randy is a good guy but he's a factory driver for Tesla at this point. Elon doesn't tolerate ANY criticism so as long as Elon's checks are clearing, you won't hear anything negative from Randy.

Randy is a driver for Unplugged Performance, not Tesla/Elon and if you listen to him, he appreciates many cars, not just Tesla's, he's obviously impressed with the Plaid.

If I was seriously considering a Tesla Model S, the base version is a no brainer. It's faster than most road cars, looks good and has reasonable luxury for an $80k car. The range is outstanding and they have the best charging network at the moment. The biggest reason not to consider a Plaid, isn't the Taycan, it's the base Model S.

100%... not sure how one can justify the Plaid over the base S. 0-60 of 3.1s is more than fast enough.

Speaking of fast enough... the Porsche Bugatti/Rimac announcement today was extremely exciting. Hope Rimac improves Porsche tech.

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