SOH of battery of my Taycan 4S 93kWh battery after 30.000 km

PanameraFrank

Well-Known Member
First Name
Frank
Joined
Sep 6, 2019
Threads
14
Messages
912
Reaction score
1,490
Location
Seattle
Vehicles
Taycan 4S
Country flag
Apps like this can be a bit of guesswork and not the most reliable, as they can't tap into protected systems of the battery.

I'm at 20k miles and do the same trips over and over again. In my experience carefully monitoring range, conditions, soc, efficiency, charging data, etc.. I estimate my battery capacity has dropped by 1% to 4% at most.

In short, very minimal loss and no change to how I plan trips. Certainly nothing to be concerned about whatsoever and as of 20k miles I feel very good about my battery health.

I also charge to 100% and use superchargers (350kw) much more often than most will, which would (in theory) result in higher than average rate of battery degradation.
Sponsored

 

Visceral

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
223
Reaction score
156
Location
The Northwest
Vehicles
991 Turbo S. Spyder and CT4S on the way
Country flag
I'm interested in what Porsche uses for 0% and 100% cell voltages (and especially compared to Tesla.) Both the Model S and Taycan both use very similar battery chemistry and construction, but i suspect Porsche is far more conservative. I have a two large banks of LiFePO4 that I run from 2.75v to 3.65 repeatedly and look forward to 3000+ discharge cycles before seeing 80% performance.
 

Visceral

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
223
Reaction score
156
Location
The Northwest
Vehicles
991 Turbo S. Spyder and CT4S on the way
Country flag
I do realize that the EV's are LiIon and not LiFePO4, but I'm interested in the cell voltage range use for each brand. That would allow us to compare apples to apples.
 

Arno

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Threads
17
Messages
240
Reaction score
397
Location
Europe
Vehicles
Porsche Taycan Turbo S & Tesla Model-S 100D
Country flag
A question a little outside of this post, but perhaps still relevant: Porsche's 8-year warranty replaces the main battery if the power is below 70 percent / 160,000 km (100,000 miles). Right? Just to be safe, at the next service in the autumn of 2022 I will ask my Porsche Center to give the exact status of the main battery on my TS.

I have treated the battery with respect, and kept the charge level below 85% for daily use. Only topped for longer trips when departure shortly after completion of charging. This is as adviced / recommended from Porsche, so I am very qurious what the result would be then after 2 years of ownership.
 
Last edited:

Visceral

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
223
Reaction score
156
Location
The Northwest
Vehicles
991 Turbo S. Spyder and CT4S on the way
Country flag
I do realize that the EV's are LiIon and not LiFePO4, but I'm interested in the cell voltage range use for each brand. That would allow us to compare apples to apples.
From what I'm finding, Porsche discharges their E66a LG Chem cells to 3.08v whereas Tesla discharges 1865 and their new 2170 and 4680 to 2.85v at their 0% state of charge. There's not much energy in those last .23v between the two discharge strategies.
 


SHM

Active Member
First Name
oOo
Joined
Feb 2, 2022
Threads
0
Messages
44
Reaction score
20
Location
Sweden
Vehicles
Taycan 4S
Country flag
I'm interested in what Porsche uses for 0% and 100% cell voltages (and especially compared to Tesla.) Both the Model S and Taycan both use very similar battery chemistry and construction, but i suspect Porsche is far more conservative. I have a two large banks of LiFePO4 that I run from 2.75v to 3.65 repeatedly and look forward to 3000+ discharge cycles before seeing 80% performance.
It wont be that easy to draw conclusions.

Wear comes by:
* Charge cycles
* Time at extremes (especially high SoC, but also low)
* BMS quality
* Extreme temperatures (especially heat)
* Aging of battery
* High speed charging
* High temperatures in battery (extreme driving, quick charging, extreme ambient temp)

I would not say Taycan has similar battery as Tesla. Taycan has same type LG pouches as Opel Ampera-e/GM. So it's large squares. Tesla has small rund cells.

There is a large difference there both in wiring and also in cooling. Tesla cools between cells, Taycan cools a plate below the large pads. Question that nobody knows is heat transfer etc. Like how hot is maximum heat of any point of any given cell in Tacyan battery under high heat use?

So with all these factors, we can't kindof use the Tesla wear statistics for Taycan, as the batteries are not similar at all really.
 

whitex

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2021
Threads
58
Messages
4,851
Reaction score
3,993
Location
WA, USA
Vehicles
2023 Taycan TCT, 2024 Q8 eTron P+
Country flag
It wont be that easy to draw conclusions.

Wear comes by:
* Charge cycles
* Time at extremes (especially high SoC, but also low)
* BMS quality
* Extreme temperatures (especially heat)
* Aging of battery
* High speed charging
* High temperatures in battery (extreme driving, quick charging, extreme ambient temp)

I would not say Taycan has similar battery as Tesla. Taycan has same type LG pouches as Opel Ampera-e/GM. So it's large squares. Tesla has small rund cells.

There is a large difference there both in wiring and also in cooling. Tesla cools between cells, Taycan cools a plate below the large pads. Question that nobody knows is heat transfer etc. Like how hot is maximum heat of any point of any given cell in Tacyan battery under high heat use?

So with all these factors, we can't kindof use the Tesla wear statistics for Taycan, as the batteries are not similar at all really.
You forgot:
* High speed discharging (e.g. launch mode launches)
 
  • Like
Reactions: SHM

SHM

Active Member
First Name
oOo
Joined
Feb 2, 2022
Threads
0
Messages
44
Reaction score
20
Location
Sweden
Vehicles
Taycan 4S
Country flag
You forgot:
* High speed discharging (e.g. launch mode launches)
True:)
Also: not every cell is barn equal.
So some will get more wear than expected , some less. Warranty would og course be designed to just handle worst case, so median should be better.
 


Visceral

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
223
Reaction score
156
Location
The Northwest
Vehicles
991 Turbo S. Spyder and CT4S on the way
Country flag
They’re both LiIon with Si-based anodes. I trust Porsche to cool batteries adequately.

the biggest effect on any LiIon battery aside from how fast you charge or discharge it is how highly charged you ask it to sit for how long and how low you ask the voltage to sit for how long.

I expect Tesla to push limits based on their behavior in other areas. I expect Porsche to be very conservative based on my experience with their cars. I’m curious if that bares out in the charge and discharge strategies, but it seems like no one knows.
 

Gwaihir

Well-Known Member
First Name
Ken
Joined
Jan 19, 2020
Threads
22
Messages
395
Reaction score
301
Location
UK
Vehicles
Taycan GTS ST
Country flag
A question a little outside of this post, but perhaps still relevant: Porsche's 8-year warranty replaces the main battery if the power is below 70 percent / 160,000 km (100,000 miles). Right? Just to be safe, at the next service in the autumn of 2022 I will ask my Porsche Center to give the exact status of the main battery on my TS.

I have treated the battery with respect, and kept the charge level below 85% for daily use. Only topped for longer trips when departure shortly after completion of charging. This is as adviced / recommended from Porsche, so I am very qurious what the result would be then after 2 years of ownership.
I’ve also looked after my 2020 4S+ battery. Only ever charged at home on my 7.4kW charger. Never fast charged. Never launched. Now after 5500 miles and almost 2 years ownership having the main battery replaced due to High Voltage Error repeatedly being displayed! I’m starting to wonder;
a) if I’ve been too kind;
b) Porsche battery balance software is just crap!
 

SHM

Active Member
First Name
oOo
Joined
Feb 2, 2022
Threads
0
Messages
44
Reaction score
20
Location
Sweden
Vehicles
Taycan 4S
Country flag
I’ve also looked after my 2020 4S+ battery. Only ever charged at home on my 7.4kW charger. Never fast charged. Never launched. Now after 5500 miles and almost 2 years ownership having the main battery replaced due to High Voltage Error repeatedly being displayed! I’m starting to wonder;
a) if I’ve been too kind;
b) Porsche battery balance software is just crap!
Its not your fault, its just a rotten apple that landed in your basket. You cant be "too kind" to a battery, but it should handle normal use, you should be able to floor it in your car every day and battery should not die. But if you park at a parking house with 0% on battery and leave for 1 year, it would be your fault.. But any kind of "normal use" it should handle. So if you were to quick charge every day it should not die on you.
Sponsored

 
 




Top