SOH of battery of my Taycan 4S 93kWh battery after 30.000 km

Fish Fingers

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The actual battery never discharges below some SoC which the software will report as 0% (not true zero, if you reached true zero the battery is dead and not recoverable). The battery also never charges to true 100% as that could significantly affect its longevity. However, between the highest and the lowest that you are software allows you to charge or discharge to, there is 83.7KWh of usable energy, and the percentage is supposed to be of that region only. So when you see 100%, the battery is as full as it is allowed by software, and when it says 0% it is as low as the software will let it get to by driving (as you park it will slowly get lower, which is why Porsche says to not park the car for long times with 0% as eventually the battery will reach true zero and it will need replacement - happened to early EV's like the Tesla Roadster).
Thankyou..

So effectively, when I am adding 10% charge to the battery on the PCM/App - I am actually adding about 8.3kw and not 9.4kw.
Right?
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Midlifecrisis

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Thankyou..

So effectively, when I am adding 10% charge to the battery on the PCM/App - I am actually adding about 8.3kw and not 9.4kw.
Right?
That is how I understand it. Although you will use more than 83kW charging from 0-100 as the process is not 100% efficient, so your supply unit might say it has put in >83kW.
 

whitex

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Thankyou..

So effectively, when I am adding 10% charge to the battery on the PCM/App - I am actually adding about 8.3kw and not 9.4kw.
Right?
Correct, if your car says your SoC went up by 10% and you have the 94KWh battery, you added 8.3KWh of energy to the battery (10% of the usable part). Note however, as @Midlifecrisis pointed out, that charging is not 100% efficient, so in order to add 8.3KWh to the battery, the charger will have to deliver (and therefore report) more energy used. To add 8.3KWh to the battery, your will probably use ~9.2KWh of energy (assuming 90% efficient charging here).
 
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B61

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The actual battery never discharges below some SoC which the software will report as 0% (not true zero, if you reached true zero the battery is dead and not recoverable). The battery also never charges to true 100% as that could significantly affect its longevity. However, between the highest and the lowest that you are software allows you to charge or discharge to, there is 83.7KWh of usable energy, and the percentage is supposed to be of that region only. So when you see 100%, the battery is as full as it is allowed by software, and when it says 0% it is as low as the software will let it get to by driving (as you park it will slowly get lower, which is why Porsche says to not park the car for long times with 0% as eventually the battery will reach true zero and it will need replacement - happened to early EV's like the Tesla Roadster).
Ddoes it mean that range is calculated based on 83.7kwh?
 

whitex

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Ddoes it mean that range is calculated based on 83.7kwh?
AFAIK that and your recent driving history. It would make no sense to estimate range based on any energy you cannot use for driving.

As a side note, the SoC is an estimate in itself. It's based on a number of factors, such as voltage measurements, temperature, age of the battery, previously measured internal resistance, etc. How much you can actually get out of the battery will depend on all of the above as well as how fast you pull it out (launching will waste more energy inside the battery than hypermiling).

What I'm trying to say here is that the calculated range should be used as an estimate, not a hard number you can rely on. I always look at the range as "if I keep on driving the same way I was over last hour, the weather doesn't change and the terrain is similar, I should be able to get about that range". If I'm on a road trip, I always keep an eye on my range and (if available) the estimate % SoC at the next charger. At times, you have to slow down to conserve energy if you notice your range is short of the next charger and/or the estimate arrival SoC drops to 0% or below.
 


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Ddoes it mean that range is calculated based on 83.7kwh?
Yes it is, the buffer is not included in the use/range calculations. It is simply there to protect the battery and insure longevity.
 
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B61

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Thx foe explanation, @whitex and @epirali .
sure, i noticed that range is estimated based on last driving/history, i just didn’t know about battery.
if we are dealing with 83kwh only…than it’s hard to believe that one can achieve 400km range… even if i’m seeing such prediction quite often, that would mean about 20 kwh/100km …and that’s impossible.
 

whitex

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Thx foe explanation, @whitex and @epirali .
sure, i noticed that range is estimated based on last driving/history, i just didn’t know about battery.
if we are dealing with 83kwh only…than it’s hard to believe that one can achieve 400km range… even if i’m seeing such prediction quite often, that would mean about 20 kwh/100km …and that’s impossible.
Why impossible? 20 kwh/100km is 322.5Wh/mile and this thread reports beating it in the right conditions. Not just that, if you are talking from 100% SoC to 0%, that 83.7KWh/400km, that's 336Wh/mile. As always, it will always depend on how you drive, the weather, terrain, and even the age of the battery.
 


Fish Fingers

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That's very useful thanks.

It means that I can now set my car with a minimum charge of 50%.

Knowing that I get cheap rate for 4 hours overnight. With a 7.4kw charger - I can assume the car is charging about 7kw for 4 hours, which is 28kw potential.

At 50% SOC it will only need about 25kw (83.4 X 30%) to get to 80%.

I know there are other variables, but it's close enough.

?
 

daveo4EV

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the “true” battery state is shielded from consumers and can not be determined without Prosche diagnostic equipment - also the exact policy of how/what/why/when Porsche uses the buffer between 83.4 kWh usable capacity & 93 kWh raw capacity is buried in Porsche internal specifciation documents which I’m sure are confidential and subject to change over time as Porsche learns more about actual behavior in the wild.

Also there is a top buffer (100% charge is NOT acutal/true 100% charge) and a bottom buffer (0% is not actual raw/true 0%)

as to what the factors are and what is left/used/available well thats available to Porsche diagnostics (normal service maybe, maybe Porsche Corp. service only) but as normal owners we lack sufficient information (by design) provided by the vehicle to determine actual battery status…

we can make informed speculation, but actual facts are hard to come by other than what is reported as current battery charge-state & range and historical consumption numbers.
 
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B61

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Why impossible? 20 kwh/100km is 322.5Wh/mile and this thread reports beating it in the right conditions. Not just that, if you are talking from 100% SoC to 0%, that 83.7KWh/400km, that's 336Wh/mile. As always, it will always depend on how you drive, the weather, terrain, and even the age of the battery.
I’ve seen that…but based on my experiences (6500 km) I couldn’t imagine 29.9kwh/100miles at average speed of 65mph.
 

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.... It means that I can now set my car with a minimum charge of 50%.

Knowing that I get cheap rate for 4 hours overnight. With a 7.4kw charger - I can assume the car is charging about 7kw for 4 hours, which is 28kw potential.

At 50% SOC it will only need about 25kw (83.4 X 30%) to get to 80%....
If you set the minimum charge to 50% and the SoC is below 50% when you plug in the EVSE cable before the 4-hour window, then you will start charging outside the cheap rate hours.
 

SteveDC

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If you set the minimum charge to 50% and the SoC is below 50% when you plug in the EVSE cable before the 4-hour window, then you will start charging outside the cheap rate hours.
Right. The car starts charging right away if you are below your minimum, 50% in your case. To charge only during certain hours of the day you must set up a separate time profile, then engage that, plus the 50% one, to operate simultaneously. There’s a YouTube video on how to do this. It seems unnecessarily complicated to set up, but it works.
 

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That's very useful thanks.

It means that I can now set my car with a minimum charge of 50%.

Knowing that I get cheap rate for 4 hours overnight. With a 7.4kw charger - I can assume the car is charging about 7kw for 4 hours, which is 28kw potential.

At 50% SOC it will only need about 25kw (83.4 X 30%) to get to 80%.

I know there are other variables, but it's close enough.

?
One more reference point here. I have a 32A/220-230V charger which theoretically would mean a 7.0-7.4 kW charger. However, for some reason my charger only delivers about 6.8kW (I can see that through monitoring) and the car only reports 6.1-6.3kW charging to the battery. The rest are losses.

This means that for 25 kW you’ll need even a bit more than 4h.
 

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One more reference point here. I have a 32A/220-230V charger which theoretically would mean a 7.0-7.4 kW charger. However, for some reason my charger only delivers about 6.8kW (I can see that through monitoring) and the car only reports 6.1-6.3kW charging to the battery. The rest are losses.

This means that for 25 kW you’ll need even a bit more than 4h.
Correct - pretty std loss % (heat, cabling etc etc)
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