TSB: If E-box only was replaced by dealer, HV battery must be replaced (WNQ8) - March 17, 2023

[Tooney]

Due to an error in the Workshop Manual, the E-box was replaced on the affected vehicles
without the high-voltage battery during repairs at the Porsche dealer.

As a result, there is a possibility that a defect in a high-voltage component can result in consequential
damage in the high-voltage battery over the service life of the vehicle.

Action required: Replacing high-voltage battery

The E-box is part of the high-voltage battery scope. The E-box and high-voltage battery must only be
replaced together.
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2023/MC-10233932-0001.pdf

Sponsored

 

[Reg]

Is there a list of VINs that this applies to?

It seems that this applies to cars that went in for service for a faulty e-box: 'during repairs at the Porsche dealer"

for example some people had an issue with that here:

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/waiting-on-replacement-e-box-central-fuse-module-ct.10198/

It says: Only vehicles assigned to the campaign (see also PCSS Vehicle Information).

 

[Tooney]

Nothing else posted on NHTSA site so far.

 

[Tooney]

Is there a list of VINs that this applies to?

It seems that this applies to cars that went in for service for a faulty e-box: 'during repairs at the Porsche dealer"

for example some people had an issue with that here:

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/waiting-on-replacement-e-box-central-fuse-module-ct.10198/

It says: Only vehicles assigned to the campaign (see also PCSS Vehicle Information).

Only 9 VINs affected per this document: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2023/MC-10233981-0001.pdf

The Porsche TSB about failed heaters listed only 57 vehicles, so you may not want to rely on posted number of affected VINs.

 

[Reg]

Only 9 VINs affected per this document: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2023/MC-10233981-0001.pdf

The Porsche TSB about failed heaters listed only 57 vehicles, so you may not want to rely on posted number of affected VINs.

why do you think there are more than 57 failed heaters?

 

[dtich]

Some serious back-of-napkin-doodling here so bear with me in making a point.

The heater poll on here doesn't have more than a few dozen respondents does it? I can't find one bigger. And the GitHub one had about 200 with approx 35% saying they had a heater issue. Even if you round up liberally on both polls you don't get much more than 200 heater issues. Out of more than 100,000 cars produced. That's what's represented on the enthusiast forums.

Who would like to extrapolate out into the general ownership pool? Do we think the heater issue is 100% reported on these fora? No. Obviously. So, is it 50%. Unlikely. 25? Eh. Maybe. Even if it's 10% and true number is closer to 2000 cars with the issue, that is less than 2% of the extant fleet affected.

I can only find 7 complaints about the heater on NHTSA site for all of Taycan models and MYs.

There should be a name for the over-weighting that an issue suffers based on mentions on enthusiast sites. Perhaps it's the "Seinfeld Effect". One would think the issues are rife throughout christendom, but in fact they are generally much more rare. We had a similar effect on the Tesla sites in the early years.

Which is not to say the issues aren't real, or that they aren't in fact major issues with a significant number of affected units. It is only to say that generally the actual pervasiveness of a given issue is exaggerated.

YMMV.

 

[tchavei]

Forums amplify the problems. People come here to find information and to complain about an issue (which is great btw). Rarely we have people just posting to speak good about the car (and it would start looking like a fan club if everyone would do it). However, only a small fraction of people go online so any reported problem, must be considered as at least 10x-50x as frequent as reported on the forum because lets face it... 100k sold cars... how many members does this forum have? We're just a small sample

 

[dtich]

Exactly.

 

[Genau]

Some serious back-of-napkin-doodling here so bear with me in making a point.

The heater poll on here doesn't have more than a few dozen respondents does it? I can't find one bigger. And the GitHub one had about 200 with approx 35% saying they had a heater issue. Even if you round up liberally on both polls you don't get much more than 200 heater issues. Out of more than 100,000 cars produced. That's what's represented on the enthusiast forums.

Who would like to extrapolate out into the general ownership pool? Do we think the heater issue is 100% reported on these fora? No. Obviously. So, is it 50%. Unlikely. 25? Eh. Maybe. Even if it's 10% and true number is closer to 2000 cars with the issue, that is less than 2% of the extant fleet affected.

I can only find 7 complaints about the heater on NHTSA site for all of Taycan models and MYs.

There should be a name for the over-weighting that an issue suffers based on mentions on enthusiast sites. Perhaps it's the "Seinfeld Effect". One would think the issues are rife throughout christendom, but in fact they are generally much more rare. We had a similar effect on the Tesla sites in the early years.

Which is not to say the issues aren't real, or that they aren't in fact major issues with a significant number of affected units. It is only to say that generally the actual pervasiveness of a given issue is exaggerated.

YMMV.

Ask about the quantity of heater failures when scheduling your next service. And ask the Taycan specialist who performs your service. Anecdotally, many service centers are seeing many heater failures. Then consider the manufacturing delays reported extensively in this forum that Porsche attributed to replacement heater shortages, as they redirected heaters from new Taycan production to replace faulty ones in Taycans that had already shipped.

 

[dtich]

Yes, I tried to, but much like your comment, there are no figures to go on whatsoever. If you have any conclusions to make please do. I haven't talked to any service advisor at all, so info on that is welcome. Any info is welcome obviously -- I'm not saying *I know*, I'm saying it might be this (what I laid out).. but honestly, I was only using the heaters as an example of the amplification effect on the boards, it was not an exhaustive or conclusive study by any means. Clearly.

 

[Tooney]

Yes, I tried to, but much like your comment, there are no figures to go on whatsoever. If you have any conclusions to make please do. I haven't talked to any service advisor at all, so info on that is welcome. Any info is welcome obviously -- I'm not saying *I know*, I'm saying it might be this (what I laid out).. but honestly, I was only using the heaters as an example of the amplification effect on the boards, it was not an exhaustive or conclusive study by any means. Clearly.

There are heater failure numbers online to go on. You missed them.

 

[dtich]

POINTER?

+ My comment, that you have evidently mis-read, was that I was noting that that post, like yours, has no useful information in it, only dry snark. Which I suppose is the new currency of the internet, but, I don't need any of it thanks.

As said, I have only found mentions of 57, 135, 800.. and many of those are likely repeats; the 800 one is a FB group of UK owners that I am not privy to. The 137 is a GitHub number that echoes the posts here as well, and 57 was the original official NHTSA number from P that all agree is light and didn't take repeated replacements into account. I also asked for pointers to lists or repositories of which I may not have been aware, with none forthcoming.

All these numbers, even if it's a sum double these numbers, are in line with the idea I was trying to get across. Which clearly landed without clarity of purpose on some ears. Apologies.

Thanks for your help.

Sponsored