Why does one need a wall charger vs just a cable.

[Pjjameso]

So, curious since the car controls the charging rate and final target level why does anyone need more than a nema 14-50 cable with a ccs plug on the other end? Realize that you would not get fancy WiFi connectivity etc. What function is the wall box actually performing? Or is it all a scam?

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[Jhenson29]

There are additional control signals for J1772. You do in fact need an EVSE. It’s not a scam.

I would look up J1772 or EVSE to read more.

Edit: or just wait for daveo4EV to respond. ?

 

[daveo4EV]

@Pjjameso

the external charger (PMC, PMCC, ClipperCreek, ChargePoint, Tesla Wall Connector, Tesla Mobile Connector, Juicebox, Blink, Electricify American's home charger) is mostly a safety feature. it’s called an EVSE - Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment…

it is in fact _NOT_ a charger - as noted by @Jhenson29 it's simply an external "switch/relay" - the actual charger that converts AC power to DC power for the battery is inside the vehicle - but people commonly refer to the EVSE as a "charger" - they are incorrect - but it doesn't matter - EVSE's actually perform a bare minimum function more like a "water meter" - they don't modify the flow/characteristics of the electricity (just like a water meter does not filter the water - H20 just passes through unmodified - same with EVSE) - EVSE just turn the flow on/off based on commands from the vehicle…they are in fact super simple devices but provide the role of charging safety for home & public charging.

An EVSE's main/primary function is to prevent the charging cable/connector from being electrified unless it’s actually plugged into a vehicle - and this is a very very very good thing - it means the cable is NOT live when it’s not plugged in and it won’t electrocute you if you drop it into a puddle when it’s raining outside your garage…a raw/simple 240 volt 40 amp extension cord is "LIVE" and may not behave well when subjected to a puddle you are standing in…it may in fact kill you.

it’s 2nd function (after the above #1 safety feature) is to communicate to the vehicle it’s electrical capacity (breaker size and capacity) so that the vehicle can adjust it’s charging demands to match the capacity of the external EVSE…

this way when you plug your 48 amp Taycan into a 16 amp chevy Volt charger (try it, it will work) the Taycan knows to only request 16 amps…

or when you plug your 48 amp Taycan into your 32 amp Panamera eHybrid charger - again the Taycan will only charge at 32 amps to match the capacity of the Panamera eHybrid charger.

EVSE main feature summary:

1. safety - no electricity if not plugged into a vehicle to avoid killing EV owners in droves - the industry felt killing their customers would be bad for business.
2. capacity - tell the charger inside the EV how much electrical capacity (AMPS) can be provided so that both parties (the vehicle and external charger) don’t over load each other.

a “raw“ or “bare” 240 volt cable would not provide either function #1 or #2…this would be nothing more than a fancy extension cord - and extension cords "are" live and have no safety features and do not communicate electrical capacity…the J-1772 standard is specifically there to avoid the pitfalls of a simple/dumb/passive extension cord.

yes you could charge your EV with nothing more than "raw" power via an extension cord style design - but the industry decided against this and instead we have the J-1772 standard which offers safety and capacity control for reasons that I hope are obvious from this posting.

in North American the PMC or PMCC from Porsche serves the role of a J-1772 compliant EVSE and will charge any other North American J-1772 (all of them) EV providing safety and capacity control

I hope this answers your question.

 

[DGT]

Great info. Thanks.

 

[Crick]

in North American the PMC or PMCC from Porsche serves the role of a J-1772 compliant EVSE

Hi @daveo4EV,
If one has a PMC which serves the role of a J-1772 compliant EVSE, what is the incremental value of a ClipperCreek or other EVSE over the PMC?

(I have discovered and read these posts, but didn't find a clear understanding of the incremental value question)

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/pmcc-overheated.2365/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/why-does-one-need-a-wall-charger-vs-just-a-cable.5149/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...-turns-red-and-says-breaker-needs-reset.4979/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/show-your-home-charging-setup-for-your-taycan.3032/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/nema-14-50-supply-cable-heat-data.1940/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/home-chargers-clippercreek-or-chargepoint.4692/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/ditch-the-pmcc-for-now.1996/)

 

[Mike in CA]

Hi @daveo4EV,
If one has a PMC which serves the role of a J-1772 compliant EVSE, what is the incremental value of a ClipperCreek or other EVSE over the PMC?

(I have discovered and read these posts, but didn't find a clear understanding of the incremental value question)

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/pmcc-overheated.2365/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/why-does-one-need-a-wall-charger-vs-just-a-cable.5149/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...-turns-red-and-says-breaker-needs-reset.4979/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/show-your-home-charging-setup-for-your-taycan.3032/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/nema-14-50-supply-cable-heat-data.1940/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/home-chargers-clippercreek-or-chargepoint.4692/
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/ditch-the-pmcc-for-now.1996/)

I already had a Clipper Creek 9.6 KW EVSE to charge my wife's Audi but I would have gotten one for the Taycan anyway if I didn't.

For me, the main value is simple convenience. I like to keep the PMC (and the unit for the Audi) in the vehicles so that I have them available when traveling. That way I don't have to repeatedly dismount/mount the units on the wall and plug/unplug their 14-50 connector.

 

[Klepper]

I use the PMC+ that came with the car as my home charger that I use everyday. For travel, I purchased a much smaller, cheaper Mustart Travel Charger ($379). The various power pigtails (to use on other style of plugs) for the Mustart are only $50 each.

This seemed like a cheaper way to go rather than getting a Clippercreek (or alternative) for ~$650 and buying power pigtails for the PMC+ that are $200 each.

 

[nycebo]

Klepper, I agree with you about putting a Mustart travel charger in the car for size. However in regards to the PMC+ as a home "switch", it is occasionally unreliable, requiring a disconnect and reconnect from the wall to clear an error. It sounds like Clippercreek and Chargepoint chargers are a bit more "predictable".

Anyway, I definitely want to get the travel charger from Mustart after hearing all the good reviews.

 

[AndiL]

Klepper, I agree with you about putting a Mustart travel charger in the car for size. However in regards to the PMC+ as a home "switch", it is occasionally unreliable, requiring a disconnect and reconnect from the wall to clear an error.

What kind of error are you referring to?

 

[Klepper]

Klepper, I agree with you about putting a Mustart travel charger in the car for size. However in regards to the PMC+ as a home "switch", it is occasionally unreliable, requiring a disconnect and reconnect from the wall to clear an error. It sounds like Clippercreek and Chargepoint chargers are a bit more "predictable".

Anyway, I definitely want to get the travel charger from Mustart after hearing all the good reviews.

I don't know about others, but my PMC+ has worked flawlessly since I got the car.

 

[DACSarasota]

This post is confusing me. Is the PMC the "Mobile Charger Plus" that comes as standard equipment with the Taycan?

If so, will that alone address the two concerns of safety and capacity that daveoEV4 raises above?

I would be disappointed to learn that I need to buy a separate wall charger for over $600 now.

 

[daveo4EV]

the PMC+/PMCC is a full EVSE and addresses all issues listed above

 

[Klepper]

This post is confusing me. Is the PMC the "Mobile Charger Plus" that comes as standard equipment with the Taycan?

If so, will that alone address the two concerns of safety and capacity that daveoEV4 raises above?

I would be disappointed to learn that I need to buy a separate wall charger for over $600 now.

The Porsche Mobile Charger Plus = PMC+

It is what comes standard, for free, with the car (at least in the US).

 

[nycebo]

What kind of error are you referring to?

No clue. I get a red light on the charger and no light showing any longer beside the charging port on the car. To resolve it, I press the button to pull out the plug to the car, unplug the PMC+, plug it back in, plug the charger back into the car and all is well. Could this be a PCM connection issue as I have bad cellular signal to the car down in the garage?

Anyway, it's not flawless but it's fine enough.

 

[AndiL]

No clue. I get a red light on the charger and no light showing any longer beside the charging port on the car. To resolve it, I press the button to pull out the plug to the car, unplug the PMC+, plug it back in, plug the charger back into the car and all is well. Could this be a PCM connection issue as I have bad cellular signal to the car down in the garage?

Anyway, it's not flawless but it's fine enough.

Maybe there is something wrong with the power infrastructure, maybe an issue with ground connection or something else. This kind of error is not normal.

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