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Discussion in 'General Topics' started by domin1720, May 28, 2019.
Jury is still out!
From new info according to PAG_J1, https://www.taycanforum.com/threads/taycan-q-a.321/
the jury is kinda finished and is just waiting for the judge to read the verdict.
Front and Rear flares/haunches will be toned down just like they are on the mules.
Gone are the suicide doors, so they will look like the mules.
Interior will be mostly the same as Mission-E, but with changes, so lots like you see in the mules.
There will be 19" & 21" wheels though, so that's a good thing as we suspect the Mission-E had 21" wheels
Basically, outside of very minor details such as tape around rear lights and a few stickers to throw your eye off (right in front of front doors), it will look like the mules.
It's also thought to have lesser range to boot, so... eh, I'm likely pulling deposit back and waiting. I have a perfectly good 2 year old vehicle now.
I think I'm holding my reservation, I wasnt expecting The suicide doors to make it. I guess I wanna see the curves in another color Before I Commit or back out.
The door line and subsequent pillar behind it is drastically different as well as other more angular style cues that will not be making the cut.
On a quick glance they are similar, but the devil is in the details.
That's the point. The black color on the latest test mules won't give you the real expression of the curves and the design of the car.
If you see it in a finished paint colour, it looks way better.
I just hope that EVENTUALLY they come out with either a suicide door Taycan like the Mission E was, or an actual 2 door Taycan. I don't need a 4 door, and don't really "want" a 4 door, but with the suicide doors and ridiculous wheel flares, it looked like a 2 door at first glance. It threw my eye off just enough to make it really attractive. When they took that away, they essentially took away my desire to pay that much money for the Taycan before a) more charging stations are available, b) the better battery technology that has been rumored to be a year(ish) away comes out, or c) a two door model (or suicide door model) is made available at roughly the same/similar price point.
I'm hopeful because I trust Porsche and their reliability is amazing, and that's on top of them being owned by VW which is one of the biggest companies in the entire world, so they're stable (unlike Tesla). But a car that looks like a standard 4 door, just sportier and fancy headlights just doesn't turn my crank so to speak. If the Audi E-Tron sport looks close to their concept, then to me, that will be the better looking car than the Taycan, and with it being inside the VW family and "using the Taycan platform", I don't know why those like me wouldn't go towards Audi instead of Porsche.
Either that, or I keep waiting for a true 2 door to come out. Tesla Roadster is $200k and set for 2020 right? At $200k you have a 2.3 second 0-60 vehicle with 250mph top speed and only 2 doors. Oh, and sexy as hell. I'm sure you can get that Taycan 4 door sports saloon to approach $200k. So bang for the buck simply isn't there with the Taycan, not with the current "boring" design. Other companies pull off Suicide doors, and other Porsche's have crazy wheel flares. I truly think Porsche missed a golden opportunity to make people forget about the inherent concerns with an EV vehicle and purchase a Taycan based on not only their heads, but their hearts.
That's my $.02 though. Obviously others disagree. If we all agreed with me, this world would get pretty boring pretty quickly because we'd all drive the same exact cars, and what was once exotic would become monotonous.
I'm in the need for 4 door for another 5 years or so. But a 2 door taycan would look amazing. The only area I would disagree is trusting Tesla . They seem to be on a downward spiral
I know, it's why I'm so far refusing to give them my money. haha
I understand your points but they're not thought through. That's a thing I often see here on the forums..
Let me explain a few things:
1.) Concept cars are like their name - just concepts. They are build to show the public what could be possible in the near future. It's more like a show off between the different OEMs and to tease some new design language. And still the Taycan is a production car which is atypical very close to his concept.
2.) Tesla Roadster isn't near a production version. The data about the car won't be possible in a production model in 2020 at 'just' a price tag from 200k. I don't even started to talk about the quality difference between a Porsche and a Tesla...
3.) Taycan and Mission E were always targeted as 4-door Sedan cars. With suicide doors or without. Maybe they'll will bring a 2 door Taycan one day but that was never the initial intention.
4.) Suicide doors won't be economic for a company like Porsche. They would have invest so much money into development and stuff to make the suicide doors with Porsches pretension of quality, that in the end the car would have had a starting price at probably over 300k. And no customer is willing to pay that. Always remind that OEM's are trying to offer all customer needs, but they're still companies which have to look at finance numbers and efficiency.
5.) Last but not least everyone are just making their opinion with pictures of test mules. They aren't reflect the finished version in every aspect!
I don't want to forbid your opinion on the car. I just wanted to clarify that there are often much more things involved in decisions in term of producing cars.
Thanks and kind regards
Thanks for all your feedback.
Thanks for your time, and I don't expect most to follow my sentiment. Like all things in life, everyone has their tastes.
I do know that the "concepts" that companies trot out every year rarely make it to production, let alone stay true to their concepts. And I hate to bring up Tesla for a variety of reasons, but their production vehicle always stays true to their concept. Porsche marketed and took deposits on the Mission E. Including it in their very marketing material to this very day. To me, that's "bait and switch" territory, and it really breeds mistrust between consumer and company.
Do I expect Tesla to go 2.3secons with 250mph? Not really, but I will say this: They never veer far from concept to production vehicle. And yes, I realize Tesla is as likely to go bankrupt as be around in the next decade, which is why I haven't bought one and hold out hope for Porsche (even stated as much in my reply above).
I also know Taycan/Mission E was made as a 4 door. I just really dislike the way a standard 4 door looks, and unfortunately, the Taycan fits right in that category of "boring" 4 door sports saloon. I mean, they hyped everyone on the Mission E and turned around and gave us what the mules (camo and all) looks. They have videos of drivers, and legendary drivers taking the Mission E around to pump up the Taycan hype. I just simply don't know why they'd do that and then deliver the car that the mules look like. Let alone still have the Mission E on their actual website when you click on their production cars you can buy.
It's just to me, and my opinion, that golden opportunities were missed. If it's $300k for a suicide door Taycan, then make a 2 door. I'm not sure where the gap in thinking came that people who want an EV MUST want a 4 door EV only. I just don't get it.
Who knows, maybe they'll have a 911-E which is an EV 911 and charge whatever it is they charge for it. I just don't understand why the Taycan is a 4 door and then they double down on a 4 door with a cross turismo. Why make two 4-Door saloons and offer exactly zero other options for people who simply don't need/want a 4 door? For a company that is founded on 2 door sports cars, I simply don't understand the logic behind offering only 4 door options in that specific category of car (EV's). At least the suicide doors temporarily made many of us forget it was indeed a 4 door because of the aesthetics. If it's impractical, then make a 2 door. You've always been a 2 door company, so it just baffles me that when you finally offer an EV car, you would refuse to make a 2 door version of it.
It's why I'm just gonna hold out hope I suppose. I really don't want to give Tesla my money. I'd much rather give Porsche my money, but I'm not going to blindly give it for "close enough." Porsche was never a company that was "close enough", and I feel like with the Taycan, that's the mentality they're selling, which to me personally, is quite disappointing.
I can understand what's your point.
Just remind that the Taycan is Porsche's first EV. And therefore a 4-door car is because of the following points the best strategic decision:
1.) 4 door cars are way better than 2-door cars right now to fit in a battery with enough power (in terms of length and height)
2.) Taycan is a new product segment as a sedan for Porsche (and yes the Panamera is another segment and not compareable)
3.) The target customer group of this car is not the typical Porsche 2-door driver rather than Tesla drivers and EV-Fans (50% of all preordered Taycans are from new customers)
And they will also bring 2 door EV-cars in the future. The Taycan is just the beginning. I'm very sure even the 911 plattform will be electrified in the next generation (and the other product plattforms, too).
Hope you'll understand what's my point in our discussion
Thank you as always for your thoughtful replies.
Here's to holding out hope for a 2 door.
You rock PAG !!
I pretty much agree with many of your points. I wonder if the designers and marketing folks just ran with the Mission E ball so as to speak and when the actual costs to manufacture the doors and some of the other “advanced” styling concepts became known, the bean counters stepped into play. I am guessing the bean counters wanted to take as much “risk” off the table as possible on their first attempt at an EV. Also knowing Porsche must be able to compete price wise with Tesla, So with that in mind Porsche’s engineers had to back off many of the concept designs to fit into the budget.
Just a guess but often that is how those decisions are actually made.
I am a 5 time Porsche owner and am definitely in the 4 door car market. I always buy the Porsche as a gift for my wife and she drives it during the week and I am only "allowed" to drive the car on the weekends. After two Carrera cabriolets and one boxster, she WANTS a 4 door so she can drive with friends. I never understood the concept of a 4 and 5 passenger car with 2 doors! That would be only for children to climb over the seat into the back. To me, it is absurd notion to think it is good design to expect adults in their 40's and 50s or older to "climb in" the back seat of a 120k five passenger vehicle. And suicide doors look good, but you CANT get out from the rear unless the front door is open!! Totally impractical!
It is somewhat disappointing that the Taycan literally lost some of its flare on the front fenders and rear quarter panels, but then again, there probably are many future buyers that know nothing about the Mission E and simply will see a beautiful Porsche family sports sedan, much more stylish than the Panamera and a "cool" car. Until the 2019 model, the rear end of the Panamera was downright ugly, reminding me of a fat woman's rear end....lol. I know its superficial to make a decision on what other people think about your vehicle, but I didnt want to purchase a vehicle that my wife and friends thought were ugly in the rear. The 2019 Cayenne and the Panamera have finally been redesigned to have more attractive rear ends. The 911, Boxster and Macan have always had gorgeous with stylish rear ends. So far, the rear end of the Taycan seems to be beautiful, but just with less flare than the Mission E.
As long as the price and range are close to what has been stated, I will definitely be keeping my reservation. (I am expecting an S model to be around 115-120K. Base models are for people that want a car that looks like a Porsche but dont perform like a real one...lol)