January Delivery @Jacksonville Port (US Southeast destination)

[Dan1923]

SA is parked, i.e. at anchor out in the harbor, not at the Ro Ro dock. The Ro Ro dock is currently occupied by the Cape Wrath and Cape Washington. Hopefully once one of these ships clear out the SA should be good to go.

Or they may all just be waiting for the holiday to be over or maybe there is another Ro RO dock I can't find.

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[Prit]

SA is parked, i.e. at anchor out in the harbor, not at the Ro Ro dock. The Ro Ro dock is currently occupied by the Cape Wrath and Cape Washington. Hopefully once one of these ships clear out the SA should be good to go.

Or they may all just be waiting for the holiday to be over or maybe there is another Ro RO dock I can't find.

I was looking this morning and wondering why it stopped. We need to see when those RORO ships came in and make an assumption (12 hours) on when they will leave lol

 

[tibiafx1]

Check Georgia’s Own Credit Union. See rates below + here is the link:

https://www.georgiasown.org/personal-account-rates-service-fees/

Did your rate match one of the ones listed here when you applied with Georgia’s Own?

 

[Prit]

Did your rate match one of the ones listed here when you applied with Georgia’s Own?

I didn’t apply because the difference in payments wasn’t a ton to deal with the hassle. Credit unions require sending in paperwork and then need higher ups to approve above $100k etc.

I went with BofA and got 2.29% @72 months. I believe my rate would be 1.78% @60 months if I went to that term. I’m a platinum client and get an extra discount on the rate and the application takes 10 mins with a 20-minute approval response through an “automated underwriter” (I believe). Way easier.

 

[NoRPM22]

Has anyone here received Lease or Financing terms from Hennessy? It is getting annoying now that they promised me to send the details a week ago and still haven't. Guess it is another of the unfortunate sales technique to keep a customer in the dark until the very last moment and give no space to think of the decision. Really poor practice, especially when we are buying such high valued product.

Anyways, if I go with their web published lease terms, which are valid until Jan 4, it seems like their money factor seems reasonable. They do add a lot of junk fees as upfront payment that tilts the scale a bit. But if I go with those numbers and compare to current financing best rate of 1.75%, the cash outflow that is not going towards the principle shows a difference of $2-3k, assuming the car is kept for 5 yrs. So, that is the excess payment on a lease over financing. In other words, to say if the extra lease payment of 2-3k is a good enough insurance against potential issues with the car and technological evolution of better Porsches or other cars in next 5 yrs.

But, unless I get my exact lease terms from the dealer, I can't be sure of the above analysis!

 

[Prit]

I didn’t apply because the difference in payments wasn’t a ton to deal with the hassle. Credit unions require sending in paperwork and then need higher ups to approve above $100k etc.

I went with BofA and got 2.29% @72 months. I believe my rate would be 1.78% @60 months if I went to that term. I’m a platinum client and get an extra discount on the rate and the application takes 10 mins with a 20-minute approval response through an “automated underwriter” (I believe). Way easier.

Actually, yesterday I applied through Hennessy too just in case I show up and want to lease or go with their financing for some reason. I wanted to pull my credit again now while I’m within the 14-day window for it to count as “one” inquiry.

 

[Prit]

Has anyone here received Lease or Financing terms from Hennessy? It is getting annoying now that they promised me to send the details a week ago and still haven't. Guess it is another of the unfortunate sales technique to keep a customer in the dark until the very last moment and give no space to think of the decision. Really poor practice, especially when we are buying such high valued product.

Anyways, if I go with their web published lease terms, which are valid until Jan 4, it seems like their money factor seems reasonable. They do add a lot of junk fees as upfront payment that tilts the scale a bit. But if I go with those numbers and compare to current financing best rate of 1.75%, the cash outflow that is not going towards the principle shows a difference of $2-3k, assuming the car is kept for 5 yrs. So, that is the excess payment on a lease over financing. In other words, to say if the extra lease payment of 2-3k is a good enough insurance against potential issues with the car and technological evolution of better Porsches or other cars in next 5 yrs.

But, unless I get my exact lease terms from the dealer, I can't be sure of the above analysis!

Where did you find those terms? Can you post the link..?

I know that Porsche sets lease terms and I believe for a 36 month/12k mile lease, they are .002 (4.8%) money factor and 52% residual on a MRM of $113,800. Those terms are not the best when compared to current financing terms/rates. I have an analysis further up this thread that looks at leasing vs financing for my MRSP of $118,600. Click here.

 

[Tooney]

Benefit of buying over leasing = $13,261.68 - $3,620.33 = $9,641.35
This is really rough but you guys get it.

Thanks for details comparing getting a loan vs leasing the car. I'm going to save these steps for future use.
My take aways:
--You would spend $9641.35 more if you leased for 3 years than if you financed the car @ 6 year loan rate. In both cases the car is turned in/sold (or bought out) at the end of 3 years.

--The lease higher cost is for the option of a more guaranteed turn-in/sale price compared to that from a loan. It's impossible to know at the moment whether that option is worth it.

My understanding is Porsche lease includes gap coverage/no need for lessee to purchase gap insurance separately. I don't know what gap insurance costs, but assume it might reduce the lease premium.

Anyway, thanks for the analysis.

 

[Prit]

Has anyone here received Lease or Financing terms from Hennessy? It is getting annoying now that they promised me to send the details a week ago and still haven't. Guess it is another of the unfortunate sales technique to keep a customer in the dark until the very last moment and give no space to think of the decision. Really poor practice, especially when we are buying such high valued product.

Anyways, if I go with their web published lease terms, which are valid until Jan 4, it seems like their money factor seems reasonable. They do add a lot of junk fees as upfront payment that tilts the scale a bit. But if I go with those numbers and compare to current financing best rate of 1.75%, the cash outflow that is not going towards the principle shows a difference of $2-3k, assuming the car is kept for 5 yrs. So, that is the excess payment on a lease over financing. In other words, to say if the extra lease payment of 2-3k is a good enough insurance against potential issues with the car and technological evolution of better Porsches or other cars in next 5 yrs.

But, unless I get my exact lease terms from the dealer, I can't be sure of the above analysis!

I just called Hennessy to try to get money factor information. I was transferred to finance and the person that picked up was quite hesitant to even discuss with me - kept saying he won't know until he submits to Porsche. I countered with "usually, quotes are provided with the best possible money factor, so can you provide that..." Anyways, he said the money factor will likely be .00320 which works out to 7.68%. This further confirms that financing is best.

Per my analysis earlier, the car would need to depreciate an additional ~$9k-$10k below Porsche's estimates to make leasing better. Further, if you take a dollar today vs a dollar tomorrow (time value of money) into consideration, having the cash today to invest or utilize its purchasing power (or cashflow) today, it is still way better than leasing.

If the "insurance" benefit of leasing is worth a $9k insurance premium over 36 months, then lease. This last bit here might just be a variance of how different folks determine what they should "pay" for peace of mind.

 

[NoRPM22]

I just called Hennessy to try to get money factor information. I was transferred to finance and the person that picked up was quite hesitant to even discuss with me - kept saying he won't know until he submits to Porsche. I countered with "usually, quotes are provided with the best possible money factor, so can you provide that..." Anyways, he said the money factor will likely be .00320 which works out to 7.68%. This further confirms that financing is best.

Per my analysis earlier, the car would need to depreciate an additional ~$9k-$10k below Porsche's estimates to make leasing better. Further, if you take a dollar today vs a dollar tomorrow (time value of money) into consideration, having the cash today to invest or utilize its purchasing power (or cashflow) today, it is still way better than leasing.

If the "insurance" benefit of leasing is worth a $9k insurance premium over 36 months, then lease. This last bit here might just be a variance of how different folks determine what they should "pay" for peace of mind.

Thanks... Here are the lease terms for 2021 Taycan. https://www.hennessyporsche.com/national-lease-offers.htm

I finally got a quote from them today. Like you said, it does not look attractive as quoted. I was looking at the depreciation curve on Tesla S to plan for 5 years of ownership. Tesla depreciates about 50% in 5 yrs. If we assume the same for Taycan, the lease is coming up over $20k worse than financing per my calculations. I don't know how much the lease is negotiable, but trying to see what other offers Porsche NA can provide.

 

[Prit]

Thanks... Here are the lease terms for 2021 Taycan. https://www.hennessyporsche.com/national-lease-offers.htm

I finally got a quote from them today. Like you said, it does not look attractive as quoted. I was looking at the depreciation curve on Tesla S to plan for 5 years of ownership. Tesla depreciates about 50% in 5 yrs. If we assume the same for Taycan, the lease is coming up over $20k worse than financing per my calculations. I don't know how much the lease is negotiable, but trying to see what other offers Porsche NA can provide.

The residuals are non-negotiable and set by Porsche, but the money factor has room. Porsche is charging .002 but the dealership is marking it up to .00320 (you might know this but multiply by 2400 to get interest rate conversion) - you may be able to negotiate that markup but even at the base .002, it's still not better.

The one thing that I don't know is if the $7500 cap cost reduction also reduces the lease buyout price. If it does, might make sense to lease, get the $7500 right away with no tax law surprises, and then buyout the lease immediately to get the $7500 discount. I just don't know if that's how it works...

 

[tibiafx1]

The residuals are non-negotiable and set by Porsche, but the money factor has room. Porsche is charging .002 but the dealership is marking it up to .00320 (you might know this but multiply by 2400 to get interest rate conversion) - you may be able to negotiate that markup but even at the base .002, it's still not better.

The one thing that I don't know is if the $7500 cap cost reduction also reduces the lease buyout price. If it does, might make sense to lease, get the $7500 right away with no tax law surprises, and then buyout the lease immediately to get the $7500 discount. I just don't know if that's how it works...

Double dipping on that $7500 discount seems unlikely. Smart, but unlikely. I bet there is a clause somewhere that prevents such.
Anyway, all great discussions here. You guys have steered me away from leasing towards financing, even if I plan to sell at year 3 or 4. Thanks!

 

[BCriss20]

Does anyone have an update on our Taycans. Will I get her before year end?
If my car doesn't make it before the end of the year, can I lease it, get the tax credit off the price, then turn around and refinance?
What's the good and bad of this technique?

Thanks

 

[Dan1923]

Does anyone have an update on our Taycans. Will I get her before year end?
If my car doesn't make it before the end of the year, can I lease it, get the tax credit off the price, then turn around and refinance?
What's the good and bad of this technique?

Thanks

It's hard to say at this point. Basically no one knows.

The Siem Aristotle is anchored in the Port of Baltimore. It appears to be waiting for a dock to open up. But all the auto docks have had ships moored to them all day. It looks like work on unloading cars has stopped until the holiday is over.

Work on unloading cars might not resume until Monday... no really knows. If that's the case Siem Aristotle might no be unloaded until Tuesday or Wednesday.

Then it will have to cruise to Jacksonville to unload cars for Atlanta and Florida. But it may be hitting Jacksonville on another holiday week end which could mean it will not be unload until next year.

By Monday afternoon we should have better visibility into Siem Aristotle's schedule.

As far as the tax credit/payment for cars delivered next year... no one has a clue. It depends on what the congress does or doesn't do about EV rebates.

 

[Prit]

It's hard to say at this point. Basically no one knows.

The Siem Aristotle is anchored in the Port of Baltimore. It appears to be waiting for a dock to open up. But all the auto docks have had ships moored to them all day. It looks like work on unloading cars has stopped until the holiday is over.

Work on unloading cars might not resume until Monday... no really knows. If that's the case Siem Aristotle might no be unloaded until Tuesday or Wednesday.

Then it will have to cruise to Jacksonville to unload cars for Atlanta and Florida. But it may be hitting Jacksonville on another holiday week end which could mean it will not be unload until next year.

By Monday afternoon we should have better visibility into Siem Aristotle's schedule.

As far as the tax credit/payment for cars delivered next year... no one has a clue. It depends on what the congress does or doesn't do about EV rebates.

Porsche should just drop off all the east coast cars in Baltimore and position trucks to deliver from that port. Just saying.

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