When did Taycans become reliable?

[LotusPhil]

My MY 22 CT4 has been recovered by the AA three times in almost as many years whilst trying to DC charge. Fault eventually found to be insulation failure in the hi voltage converter which was replaced. Heater has failed, on board charger has failed, boot locking mechanism has failed twice now. Cooling fan seized and navigation system consistently fails by rebooting and forgetting its destination. 51000 miles on the clock and another year before the lease expires… I’m heartened that the new model sounds to be much improved in the reliability stakes as I’d love to replace it next year with another one.
2nd boot locking mechanism mechanism took my warranty claim total to over £20k now.
I love the car all the time it’s working and the numerous loan Macans I’ve had now have convinced me to never buy a Macan.

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[TaYcanAficionado]

fair point. Although, it is a good question what happens to 2020 owners that reach the end of the battery warranty and their battery wasn't replaced; if I had a 2020, I would be worried that the battery issue might incur right after the 8-year mark. And it is another great question whether the "up to 15 years renewable" porsche approved warranty also covers the HV battery or not.

 

[Red4S]

My 2020 4S delivered in June 2021 has had recalls and a few battery cells replaced in 2024. 5 months in a loaner Macan while at the dealer. Otherwise fine. 18,000 miles. And loaded with lots of things to go wrong!

 

[prj]

fair point. Although, it is a good question what happens to 2020 owners that reach the end of the battery warranty and their battery wasn't replaced; if I had a 2020, I would be worried that the battery issue might incur right after the 8-year mark. And it is another great question whether the "up to 15 years renewable" porsche approved warranty also covers the HV battery or not.

That has nothing to do with the 2020 in particular though. You pay your money for the battery warranty. If you want 3 years, then you buy a 21, 4 years then a 22 and so on. The price also reflects that.

That said, PIWIS shows "module aging" fault and "aging faults" of HV battery are not covered.
I am not sure how this is going to go. Legally speaking the car having red ring of death and being undriveable is pretty hard to say it's "normal aging" even if PIWIS says so.

 

[TaYcanAficionado]

valid point. People tend to forget that (almost all, to my knowledge) EV companies offer an 8year/100k miles warranty for the battery to maintain at least 70% SoH. This wording is not the same as "HV battery warranty no questions asked".
Which brings us to the question, how all manufacturers (and not just Porsche) treat customers with failed modules when not connected with a safety recall; i.e. failure not because battery isn't at least 70% SoH, but because one or more modules just failed.
Reading between the lines, I am tending to believe that if a module fails, even within 8 years/100k miles, and such failure is not connected with a safety recall (and of course, you are not on porsche approved), you will pay the module replacement from your own pocket. Unless the dealership offers some goodwill.

 

[prj]

Reading between the lines, I am tending to believe that if a module fails, even within 8 years/100k miles, and such failure is not connected with a safety recall (and of course, you are not on porsche approved), you will pay the module replacement from your own pocket. Unless the dealership offers some goodwill.

No that's not right at all.
The car is inoperable with a failed module and that's covered legally. The legal 8 year warranty is for the battery as a whole. Does not matter what it's made of.
If it fails and the car does not work then the manufacturer has to fix it. Whether they do it by replacing the whole battery, modules or individual cells, that's up to each architecture.

 

[Tooney]

That said, PIWIS shows "module aging" fault and "aging faults" of HV battery are not covered.
I am not sure how this is going to go. Legally speaking the car having red ring of death and being undriveable is pretty hard to say it's "normal aging" even if PIWIS says so.

Could you share more detail about:
-- PIWIS shows module aging fault and aging faults?
-- And those being not covered?

 

[69Mach390]

I bought a used 2024.

But only because I found a good deal on it.

Do I expect it to be more reliable? A little, but only because it’s newer with less mileage. Plus that means I get more time with the warranty.

Mechanically, the 2020-24 cars are basically identical and should perform the same long term .

 

[prj]

Could you share more detail about:
-- PIWIS shows module aging fault and aging faults?
-- And those being not covered?

When the module has a voltage difference and you get the red error, PIWIS shows an error "Aging detected" in the BMS for the module.
Porsche Approved warranty in Europe has a specific clause saying that aging related defects are not covered for a bunch of stuff including the high voltage battery.

 

[chun]

This Aging Detected error was added as part of the HV battery recalls
So it's hard to not assume they are covering their asses past those 8 years, in case the battery fails, even if it's from a manufacturing defect.
Would it be enough in court? Only one way to find out

 

[FlyingPoint]

The answer is dependent on what one deems the definition of "reliable".

For example, I have owned two Taycan's (MY 21 RWD & 2024 4S)over 5+ years now and never experienced:

1. Being stranded, other than from a pot hole induced flat tire.
2. Heater failure
3. Brake failure
4. Inverter/charging failure of any kind
5. Battery Failure of any kind
6. Red Circle of Death

If the above is important to the OP, then I can opine since MY21 my cars have been flawless as it relates to the obove.

I think that the Taycan has a long way to go with tech & mechanicals, for example:

1. Numerous data connection interruptions - really matters when temps are at or near 10F and the car can't be warmed.
2. Intermittent warnings in the rain
3. Phantom braking
4. Frequent PCM glitches.
5. Numerous recalls
6. Lack of meaningful OAT updates require frequent workshop visits

I love driving my Taycan(s), but they are a sad imitation of tech at almost every level. This is not a new revelation to me. I obtained my 2nd Taycan when the above mentioned problem issues were far more frequent. A great car to drive and own, just not out of warranty.

I love my Taycan, but it is a struggle when you live with something that works and drives perfectly every single time you use it. I often ask myself - is the drive worth it? Will I obtain another Taycan when the time comes? Probably not, its just too disappointing in those areas that matter to me. I would rather buy a weekend 911 for a lower cost of ownership.

 

[TaYcanAficionado]

I also have the opinion that the biggest problem with the taycan is the really, really bad PCM/infotainment. Spotify gets interrupted, glitches in the screen, rear camera is a joke etc. Even cars worth $20k new don't have such problems.
Ok, I am talking from the safe side because I haven't faced any severe issues with my '21 4S. No red circle of death, not getting stranded, no battery problems, no heater problems...

Regarding the OTA updates which can't even compare with tesla, there is a plausible explanation - and that's not specific to porsche, but all legacy automakers: porsche, bmw, mercedes, audi etc have a history in the ICE car industry spanning over 100+ years; they have a network of dealers and need to keep those happy. Tesla, on the other hand, was based from the beginning on a completely different business model - dealership visits only for repairs and only when absolutely necessary. Have never had tesla, but know for a fact that tesla owners just replace brake fluid and cabin filters themselves....even the detailed service manual is available online - no secrets for the DIYers...

Therefore, I can understand that Porsche and other automakers want to keep their dealership network for the future - building EVs that require no dealership visits would soon lead to their extinction and that would be a problem for their operation model., especially since 90%+ of their cars on the road right now are ICE. Just my 2 cents

 

[69Mach390]

I also have the opinion that the biggest problem with the taycan is the really, really bad PCM/infotainment. Spotify gets interrupted, glitches in the screen, rear camera is a joke etc. Even cars worth $20k new don't have such problems.
Ok, I am talking from the safe side because I haven't faced any severe issues with my '21 4S. No red circle of death, not getting stranded, no battery problems, no heater problems...

Regarding the OTA updates which can't even compare with tesla, there is a plausible explanation - and that's not specific to porsche, but all legacy automakers: porsche, bmw, mercedes, audi etc have a history in the ICE car industry spanning over 100+ years; they have a network of dealers and need to keep those happy. Tesla, on the other hand, was based from the beginning on a completely different business model - dealership visits only for repairs and only when absolutely necessary. Have never had tesla, but know for a fact that tesla owners just replace brake fluid and cabin filters themselves....even the detailed service manual is available online - no secrets for the DIYers...

Therefore, I can understand that Porsche and other automakers want to keep their dealership network for the future - building EVs that require no dealership visits would soon lead to their extinction and that would be a problem for their operation model., especially since 90%+ of their cars on the road right now are ICE. Just my 2 cents

Not sure why people think Teslas don’t have problems.

Spend any time on a Tesla forum and you’ll see that’s far from the truth.

And service (outside or the US especially) can be a nightmare due to the lack of a dealership network.

They do have some neat software. But the company also treats the drivers like Beta testers.
EVs in general have become way to software dependent and as such seem to be plagued with bugs.

I wish OTA updates were mainly for feature enhancements. Instead it’s years of fighting buggy software.

 

[prj]

I remember back in '21 or '22 driving a Model 3 and the infotainment just rebooted during the drive - full black screen.
I mean the car kept driving, but you didn't have a speed display anymore, since there isn't one besides on the main screen....

I have never had a crash with the Taycan, but of course I'm not taxing it much, since I'm just using Android Auto anyway.

 

[262X40]

Having talked personally to other owners and various service personnel, it is becoming clear that from mid 2023 onwards (model year 2024) the Taycan is proving to be consistently reliable. Moral? If buying secondhand, look for Taycans manufactured after mid 2023.

Not sure that's true. Certainly there were issues with early cars like software, brake lines, charge cords, and defective HVACs, but those were all taken care of under recalls. Best I've heard from a very reliable source is that starting with 2021 models, there was better markings and labeling for different hoses and wiring harnesses to help when servicing. I've only owned my 2021 for 9 months and had only one issue (red ring of death) that somewhat self corrected. And yes, later cars have the benefit of small changes but they're also more expensive.

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