Piwi diagnostic program for Porche Taykan

[carlos vilarinho]

The correct VCI is only one part of what is required to remove component protection, the other part is to have a genuine PIWIS subscription. You need both.

Suggest you work out how to solve component protection removal first since someone working remotely may not want to use your software in case that bricks his access to PIWIS.

For info, you can change your 12V battery, headlights and other low level items without requiring component protection removal

I can see you highlighted engineering mode in your last post, this is not component protection.

but what is your opinion, do you think that what this seller presents works on AliExpress ????….it was the link you sent me at the beginning, as for the genuine piwis subscription I can deal with that later, what I need now is to have the hardware and software to read the car, because I even suspect that the problem is really in the 12 V battery, but to know that I will have to start somewhere and without a program, whether it is with access or without and without hardware….nothing done

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[Shug]

This would certainly allow you to get going and investigate what the problems are.

The cloned software can also be used to correct errors, so would be a decent start if it works OK.

I have no connection with the seller, so cannot confirm, but my guess is you would be safe since you can return on Aliexpress.

The system that BigKraig has might be a good option too.

 

[carlos vilarinho]

This would certainly allow you to get going and investigate what the problems are.

The cloned software can also be used to correct errors, so would be a decent start if it works OK.

I have no connection with the seller, so cannot confirm, but my guess is you would be safe since you can return on Aliexpress.

The system that BigKraig has might be a good option too.

Would it be possible to send me a link to someone where I could buy the hardware and software together, who has knowledge that it works properly, it could also be this Bigkraig system, as I am not very familiar with the Porsche scanning system and everything for me now is as if it were the first time

 

[Shug]

My guess is that Bigkraig will be able to support you if you bought from him.

MARS is also a go too but be aware that none of these guys offer a manual on how to use the software, so this is not a plug and play option, it will require some effort on your part to work out what is required to access faults with the software and then what you might do about fixing the fault.

 

[whitex]

but Chun I have to agree with you in one statement I recognize that... they would never tell me the entire result of the diagnosis nor what the cause of the problem would be, because they know that immediately afterwards I would take the information and go somewhere else to fix the car... (it's as clear as water), anyway I'm going somewhere else to do the diagnosis and I'm going somewhere else to fix the car!

I think you overestimate that the PIWIS software is reporting back. Whoever scans your car next, ask for a copy of a VAL (Vehicle Analysis Logs) which the PIWIS software will generate for you - that will give you all the current settings, all the firmwares, and all the errors and available information about them. Your 420 Euros should have gotten you that (bring your own thumb drive), but I would not expect any more than that. They really don't know the cause(s) of the errors.

I work on my own cars, including the Taycan. What you paid for is initial diagnostics. They erased all the errors, and bunch of them came back, meaning the cause of the error is still there. That is what happens. With so many errors, there is either something seriously wrong with your car's many systems, or there is one thing somewhere (such as a short in a communications bus) which causes the cascading errors. The PIWIS software will not tell them what the problem is, that would have to be investigated by digging deeper, taking the car apart, and watching the error messages. The closest analog I can think of is imagine an office building reporting "phones don't work, elevator does not work, doors will not open, lights will not turn on, smoke detectors don't work, air conditioning does not work, fire detected, flood detected, fire suppression system fails, etc, etc" - the building could be on fire and all those components have broken, building might have gotten nuked by a meteor, or perhaps power to the building has been cut off, or the interconnect bus that reports all the errors have been shorted out. The software will just tell you individual errors. If you ever want to see a ton of errors in a car, stick a screw driver between the CAN bus wires, or disconnect the terminating resistor of the CAN bus, or disconnect a ground pin at a key location - this will result in a lot of errors, but none of them will tell you "screwdriver detected in a connector", they will just give you a dozen or more errors.

Would it be possible to send me a link to someone where I could buy the hardware and software together, who has knowledge that it works properly, it could also be this Bigkraig system, as I am not very familiar with the Porsche scanning system and everything for me now is as if it were the first time

You can get a cracked Chinese PIWIS3 which works without a live Porsche subscription. It will probably run you ~$1,500 with the laptop and DoIP enabled adapter that is needed for it (DoIP needed for full capabilities for Taycan work). You can also register with Porsche as an official third party shop and get the subscription for a few days, weeks, or months. HOWEVER, given your comments so far, while it will give you the same capabilities the dealer has, I doubt it will give you what YOU want. All you'll get, after you figure out how to use it, is the same list of errors you already have. The next step is actively diagnose the problem, i.e. start taking things apart, look for obvious issues, rerun diagnostics, etc - typically a time consuming process, and you need to understand what connects to what, and what can cause individual errors (e.g. maybe the rain sensor fails to respond because its power or CAN/LIN bus is not connected - you then disconnect the power and/or CAN/LIN bus and see if the error has disappeared, if not, then you know it's the problem with one or both of the connections, and you continue digging).

Overall I think you bought a car with some major issues. Usually when cars with issues are priced really low, that means the original owner was unable to fix the issues. Sure, you can get lucky, but you'll need greater expertise than the original owner had or could buy for a few grand (or they would have paid it and sold the car for more).

Full disclosure, I don't sell my service to repair cars, so not defending dealers or mechanics here. I solely work on my own cars because it's my hobby. Your car sounds like it needs some expert debugging, which yes, will include taking it apart, and someone who knows Porsche electronics.

 

[carlos vilarinho]

I think you overestimate that the PIWIS software is reporting back. Whoever scans your car next, ask for a copy of a VAL (Vehicle Analysis Logs) which the PIWIS software will generate for you - that will give you all the current settings, all the firmwares, and all the errors and available information about them. Your 420 Euros should have gotten you that (bring your own thumb drive), but I would not expect any more than that. They really don't know the cause(s) of the errors.

I work on my own cars, including the Taycan. What you paid for is initial diagnostics. They erased all the errors, and bunch of them came back, meaning the cause of the error is still there. That is what happens. With so many errors, there is either something seriously wrong with your car's many systems, or there is one thing somewhere (such as a short in a communications bus) which causes the cascading errors. The PIWIS software will not tell them what the problem is, that would have to be investigated by digging deeper, taking the car apart, and watching the error messages. The closest analog I can think of is imagine an office building reporting "phones don't work, elevator does not work, doors will not open, lights will not turn on, smoke detectors don't work, air conditioning does not work, fire detected, flood detected, fire suppression system fails, etc, etc" - the building could be on fire and all those components have broken, building might have gotten nuked by a meteor, or perhaps power to the building has been cut off, or the interconnect bus that reports all the errors have been shorted out. The software will just tell you individual errors. If you ever want to see a ton of errors in a car, stick a screw driver between the CAN bus wires, or disconnect the terminating resistor of the CAN bus, or disconnect a ground pin at a key location - this will result in a lot of errors, but none of them will tell you "screwdriver detected in a connector", they will just give you a dozen or more errors.


You can get a cracked Chinese PIWIS3 which works without a live Porsche subscription. It will probably run you ~$1,500 with the laptop and DoIP enabled adapter that is needed for it (DoIP needed for full capabilities for Taycan work). You can also register with Porsche as an official third party shop and get the subscription for a few days, weeks, or months. HOWEVER, given your comments so far, while it will give you the same capabilities the dealer has, I doubt it will give you what YOU want. All you'll get, after you figure out how to use it, is the same list of errors you already have. The next step is actively diagnose the problem, i.e. start taking things apart, look for obvious issues, rerun diagnostics, etc - typically a time consuming process, and you need to understand what connects to what, and what can cause individual errors (e.g. maybe the rain sensor fails to respond because its power or CAN/LIN bus is not connected - you then disconnect the power and/or CAN/LIN bus and see if the error has disappeared, if not, then you know it's the problem with one or both of the connections, and you continue digging).

Overall I think you bought a car with some major issues. Usually when cars with issues are priced really low, that means the original owner was unable to fix the issues. Sure, you can get lucky, but you'll need greater expertise than the original owner had or could buy for a few grand (or they would have paid it and sold the car for more).

Full disclosure, I don't sell my service to repair cars, so not defending dealers or mechanics here. I solely work on my own cars because it's my hobby. Your car sounds like it needs some expert debugging, which yes, will include taking it apart, and someone who knows Porsche electronics.

Hi good afternoon, yes, let's go there that the list I have is not complete, between having this list and not having anything is the same thing, for this reason it is necessary to make a purchase of hardware and software to remove a list of specific errors and thus know what errors there are, what has already been deleted or not and what continues to give errors, I am aware that the program will not tell me exactly where the problem is and what the problem is, but I am sure it will guide me for each error in the car! Yes, I agree that in the issue of the front windshield wipers, I think that there should be no connection to the rain sensor, but in the rest of the errors it could also have to do with the 12 V battery! The best thing is, as you mentioned, to check, disassemble and analyze, I think that to disassemble the interior by disconnecting the negative pole of the battery I will be able to check the car without any problem... correct (since it is an electric car I am a little worried)

 

[whitex]

Hi good afternoon, yes, let's go there that the list I have is not complete, between having this list and not having anything is the same thing, for this reason it is necessary to make a purchase of hardware and software to remove a list of specific errors and thus know what errors there are, what has already been deleted or not and what continues to give errors, I am aware that the program will not tell me exactly where the problem is and what the problem is, but I am sure it will guide me for each error in the car! Yes, I agree that in the issue of the front windshield wipers, I think that there should be no connection to the rain sensor, but in the rest of the errors it could also have to do with the 12 V battery! The best thing is, as you mentioned, to check, disassemble and analyze, I think that to disassemble the interior by disconnecting the negative pole of the battery I will be able to check the car without any problem... correct (since it is an electric car I am a little worried)

You can read and delete errors using much cheaper software, like OBDeleven, or even free CarScanner phone app (still need an OBD adapter, under $100). The errors will come back if the cause is not removed.

As for the high voltage in the car, the concern might be about who was working on it before and did they screw something up - this car has obviously been worked on by someone with no service history reported to Porsche. Worth noting that there is a "fireman's loop" disconnect in the trunk (and one on the back IIRC) which will disable the 800V battery, though that will throw even more errors on the PIWIS which expects the battery to be on. The "12V" battery will because the sole source of power for all the electronics, which will drain it quickly while the car is on (within very few hours) since it can no longer be replenished from the 800V battery. The disconnect is intended for both service as well as emergency responders and should cut off the high voltage from the entire car.

 

[carlos vilarinho]

You can read and delete errors using much cheaper software, like OBDeleven, or even free CarScanner phone app (still need an OBD adapter, under $100). The errors will come back if the cause is not removed.

As for the high voltage in the car, the concern might be about who was working on it before and did they screw something up - this car has obviously been worked on by someone with no service history reported to Porsche. Worth noting that there is a "fireman's loop" disconnect in the trunk (and one on the back IIRC) which will disable the 800V battery, though that will throw even more errors on the PIWIS which expects the battery to be on. The "12V" battery will because the sole source of power for all the electronics, which will drain it quickly while the car is on (within very few hours) since it can no longer be replenished from the 800V battery. The disconnect is intended for both service as well as emergency responders and should cut off the high voltage from the entire car.

So what do you advise me to do so that I can check inside the car to see if there is any concern about high voltage... Do you think disconnecting the 12V battery will be enough????

 

[whitex]

So what do you advise me to do so that I can check inside the car to see if there is any concern about high voltage... Do you think disconnecting the 12V battery will be enough????

No, disconnecting 12V is not going to disconnect the 800V battery, as the 800V battery can actually provide 12V via the DC-to-DC converter to the rest of the car (it also recharges the 12V battery). At the very least, if you're going to be randomly digging in the car's wiring by yourself, I would disconnect the 800V using the safety disconnect in the trunk (and place a lock on that safety interlock so someone doesn't turn it back on, or it doesn't close itself by accident). HOWEVER, please note that I am not trained in high voltage repairs on the Taycan, so this purely my opinion, not to be taken as an official advice or a guarantee of your safety. Even at Porsche dealerships, only technicians trained in high voltage repairs are allowed anywhere near the high voltage systems. 800V can kill you. While I personally will work on my own Taycan electronics, I steer clear of any components with the high voltage connections.

I think there is a reason why you got this car for cheap, the complete diagnosis and repair would likely cost a lot of time, therefore money, from an officially trained tech. Good luck!

 

[carlos vilarinho]

No, disconnecting 12V is not going to disconnect the 800V battery, as the 800V battery can actually provide 12V via the DC-to-DC converter to the rest of the car (it also recharges the 12V battery). At the very least, if you're going to be randomly digging in the car's wiring by yourself, I would disconnect the 800V using the safety disconnect in the trunk (and place a lock on that safety interlock so someone doesn't turn it back on, or it doesn't close itself by accident). HOWEVER, please note that I am not trained in high voltage repairs on the Taycan, so this purely my opinion, not to be taken as an official advice or a guarantee of your safety. Even at Porsche dealerships, only technicians trained in high voltage repairs are allowed anywhere near the high voltage systems. 800V can kill you. While I personally will work on my own Taycan electronics, I steer clear of any components with the high voltage connections.

I think there is a reason why you got this car for cheap, the complete diagnosis and repair would likely cost a lot of time, therefore money, from an officially trained tech. Good luck!

When talking to the Porsche service the other day, the guy told me that here the car could have two problems: either it pointed to the 12V battery or it pointed to the DC/DC converter, one of them could give all these errors, now to change the DC/DC converter will have to be someone specialized in this type of service, because here it includes working with high voltage, changing the 12V battery I honestly don't know if it's just disconnecting the two poles and removing the battery like any other car! Another thing can you explain to me more or less where it is located in the trunk (safety disconnect in the trunk) to disconnect the 800V battery?

 

[whitex]

Another thing can you explain to me more or less where it is located in the trunk (safety disconnect in the trunk) to disconnect the 800V battery?

Double check with your specific model year user manual, but below is a picture of said switch which I found on the internet (I think it's the interlock with the green padlock). Full disclosure, I never touched any of my high voltage components in my car, so I know this from theory only, therefore personally cannot guarantee the 800V will be off everywhere, especially if someone messed with your car in the past (they could have bypassed this switch for example, people do stupid things sometimes when trying to get cars to run).

 

[carlos vilarinho]

Double check with your specific model year user manual, but below is a picture of said switch which I found on the internet (I think it's the interlock with the green padlock). Full disclosure, I never touched any of my high voltage components in my car, so I know this from theory only, therefore personally cannot guarantee the 800V will be off everywhere, especially if someone messed with your car in the past (they could have bypassed this switch for example, people do stupid things sometimes when trying to get cars to run).

I really appreciate all the information, yes sometimes people do pretty stupid things, anyway! So this switch turns off the 800v load, I assume that to reconnect the battery load and just turn the switch back on, I also don't want to mess with absolutely anything that has to do with the high voltage of the battery, in fact if in the case it is the DC/DC that is broken I will have to find someone to do the change for me! I just want to check the interior of the car in terms of the interior wiring, nothing else could there be any tangled wires inside or something like that and that's it and obviously I want to check for safety I don't like to take unnecessary risks!

 

[carlos vilarinho]

I really appreciate all the information, yes sometimes people do pretty stupid things, anyway! So this switch turns off the 800v load, I assume that to reconnect the battery load and just turn the switch back on, I also don't want to mess with absolutely anything that has to do with the high voltage of the battery, in fact if in the case it is the DC/DC that is broken I will have to find someone to do the change for me! I just want to check the interior of the car in terms of the interior wiring, nothing else could there be any tangled wires inside or something like that and that's it and obviously I want to check for safety I don't like to take unnecessary risks!

 

[whitex]

Last piece of advice, stay away from bright orange wires, they are always high voltage (you can see some of them on the picture with the safety interlock, connected to the heater and the onboard charger).

 

[Shug]

One thing that has not been discussed is that you need a 100amp 12v battery charger to be connected while you are using PIWIS, if you do not have this, you may introduce further errors to the system since the battery voltage will fall steadily while you are diagnosing with PIWIS.

Something like this is ideal since it can be set and hold a specific voltage since a voltage of 14.5v needs to be held during your PIWIS session for best results.

Regular smart battery chargers are not what you want.

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