[opinion] - hmmm…VW/Audi/Porsche _IS_ in trouble… [⚠️ ADMIN WARNING: NO INSULTING / POLITICALLY CHARGED POSTING]

[Fun TC Driving]

Thank you tigerbalm for your very specific, useful information you shared. Going to be interesting how this shakes out.

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[Tooney]

Porsche's Cost-Cutting To Claim Another 5,000 Jobs: Report

Porsche appoints new production chief, reportedly puts more EV projects on hold

Meanwhile, Der Spiegel reports that Michael Leiters, who became Porsche CEO on 1 January 2026, has asked for time until early October to finalise the company’s strategy. According to the report, however, the direction is already becoming clear: Porsche intends to refocus on its roots as a “sports car manufacturer” and define the brand more through exclusive combustion-engine models than through electric vehicles, as it did under former CEO Oliver Blume.

Former CEO Oliver Blume had already postponed the large electric SUV, internally known as the K1, until the 2030s. According to Der Spiegel, Michael Leiters has now also delayed a second project—an all-electric version of the Panamera—”well into the next decade”. The report further states that Porsche is distancing itself from Volkswagen’s software partnership with US electric vehicle manufacturer Rivian.

Overall, the report suggests that Porsche is shifting its focus back towards its traditional strengths. “It feels like we’ve turned back the clock ten years,” Der Spiegel quotes a frustrated developer as saying.

 

[Tooney]

VW is trading German pride for Chinese code - L3 autonomous driving from 2027
The latest and most ambitious manifestation of this new approach is a tech marriage with Chinese intelligent-driving specialist Horizon Robotics through their joint venture, Carizon. The goal is clear, aggressive, and bound to make rival executives sweat - delivering full Level 3 autonomous driving capabilities to customers in China as early as the second half of 2027. For a company that was struggling to make a basic backup camera interface behave a few years ago, aiming for eyes-off, hands-off autonomy is a huge leap forward.

Digitally speaking, this isn't yet another boring marketing agreement wrapped in corporate fluff. Carizon is using a "white-box" licensing model, which essentially means Volkswagen gets unrestricted access to Horizon's advanced AI foundation models. This brainpower will be integrated with a custom-developed C7H system-on-chip and an incredibly clever data platform dubbed GAIA.

By marrying the AI smarts directly to the silicon, the vehicle will be capable of processing real-world environments in milliseconds. This lays down the foundation not just for Level 3 highway cruising, but eventually Level 4 driverless robotaxi networks that can handle chaotic urban environments without breaking a sweat.

This tech isn't destined to sit inside a laboratory gathering dust either. The digital architecture is being hardwired directly into the brand's freshly minted China Electronic Architecture, or CEA, which was co-developed alongside the EV mavericks at XPeng. We are already seeing the early fruits of this collaborative labor trickling down to actual production cars. Advanced driver-assist packages have already rolled out on the ID. UNYX 07 and its high-riding sibling, the ID. UNYX 08 SUV, bringing highway navigation assistance and clever memory parking out to the masses.

But why is Volkswagen moving with such urgency? Because the Chinese domestic market is an absolute meat grinder where complacency means swift death. The local buyers treat digital features not as optional luxury boxes to tick - they are the baseline requirements. The scale of the shift is telling: more than 30% of all new vehicles sold in China during the first half of this year came with advanced navigation-assisted driving functions as standard.

In a market where software adoption rates regularly climb from 30% to 40% in the blink of an eye, legacy players are under such extreme pressure that they are practically lining up outside the doors of local tech firms with open checkbooks. Stellantis is out there running robotaxi trials with Pony AI in Europe, and Mercedes-Benz is testing automated services with Momenta over in Abu Dhabi.

What we are witnessing is the birth of a hybrid era. The traditional barriers that once separated automotive hardware from raw computing power have completely dissolved. Volkswagen is effectively acknowledging that to survive the electric gold rush, it must stop trying to be a software company and start being a world-class integrator of local expertise.

If this deepened Carizon tie-up delivers on its promises by the second half of 2027, the German giant might just prove that it is possible to teach an old dog some digital tricks. Turn the dial to 11, let the silicon do the heavy lifting, and let's see if this legacy titan can truly reclaim its crown. Though, I wonder - with many manufacturers dismissing the L3 as unnecessary (since the L2+ is basically the same, and jumping straight to L4 makes more sense) - is VW chasing the wrong dream? Again?

 

[chun]

“It feels like we’ve turned back the clock ten years,” Der Spiegel quotes a frustrated developer as saying.

Definitely concerning, since porsche was already stuck in the 90s - early 2000s in terms of business.

So now they're back to the good old 80s They should power their factories with coal while at it... oh wait, germany already does that, so i guess all is as planned

 

[chun]

This tech isn't destined to sit inside a laboratory gathering dust either. The digital architecture is being hardwired directly into the brand's freshly minted China Electronic Architecture, or CEA, which was co-developed alongside the EV mavericks at XPeng.

While they are struggling to get a car of the ground on that platform from Xpeng for the Chinese market exclusively, Xpeng is already building L3 capable cars in Austria for the european market on similar platforms.

VW fails yet again at having a global strategy. Time is ticking, and their refusal to bring any good tech in europe will cost them when the chinese take over the european market as well.

 

[Vim Schrotnock]

I just don't see how the 'legacy' car companies can really compete in the EV market. The top 4 EV companies in the world started with ZERO experience building cars. They also started with zero employees, dealerships, factories, suppliers, and retirees. Legacy companies just don't have the expertise or the cost structure to compete against a pure EV venture that doesn't have the burden of supporting multiple obsolete functions and a large retiree base. I think the writing is on the wall...

 

[Zcd1]

I just don't see how the 'legacy' car companies can really compete in the EV market... think the writing is on the wall...

Unless they make drastic adjustments to their business models, I fear that you're correct.

 

[Sace]

Porsche's Cost-Cutting To Claim Another 5,000 Jobs: Report

Porsche appoints new production chief, reportedly puts more EV projects on hold

Meanwhile, Der Spiegel reports that Michael Leiters, who became Porsche CEO on 1 January 2026, has asked for time until early October to finalise the company’s strategy. According to the report, however, the direction is already becoming clear: Porsche intends to refocus on its roots as a “sports car manufacturer” and define the brand more through exclusive combustion-engine models than through electric vehicles, as it did under former CEO Oliver Blume.

Former CEO Oliver Blume had already postponed the large electric SUV, internally known as the K1, until the 2030s. According to Der Spiegel, Michael Leiters has now also delayed a second project—an all-electric version of the Panamera—”well into the next decade”. The report further states that Porsche is distancing itself from Volkswagen’s software partnership with US electric vehicle manufacturer Rivian.

Overall, the report suggests that Porsche is shifting its focus back towards its traditional strengths. “It feels like we’ve turned back the clock ten years,” Der Spiegel quotes a frustrated developer as saying.

Will be interesting to see this strategy in October. It feels more and more like Porsche is a brand I would never consider again.

 

[chun]

I just don't see how the 'legacy' car companies can really compete in the EV market.

Well... the same way the chinese did?

German automakers received subsidies also. But instead of using them to sell afforable EVs, at a loss, by compensating with the subsidies, they decided to sell premium EVs with a substantial profit margin and also pocket the subsidies as "R&D expenses".

The strategy seems to have worked well for the chinese. Of course, I can imagine that selling the investors the idea of selling cars at a loss instead of 10-50% profit margin, to capture market and establish a tech moat in the EV world, is not a easy thing to do. But again, the chinese somehow managed.

The market has been begging for afforable cars for a decade, because all you can find in europe is "premium" cars, and when the time to enter the EV market came, all automakers decided: "I know what the people want, more premium cars they can't afford to own!" Big brain strategy And then they held meetings with investors to tell them how difficult the market is, how nobody wants to buy their overprice "premium" junkfor 50% profit margin prices.

Honesly, it's such a basic concept, that only the germans could fail at it, as they fail at most simple non-complicated things. New phone maker enters the market? Sells at a loss, to capture some market and establish a customer base. New tooth brush maker enters the market? Sells at a loss, to capture market. New "bottled air from antartica in a jar" company enters the market? Sells at a loss, to capture market.

Very very very basic concept.

Around 2022, numbers were floting around that the base taycan sells for a 10% profit margin, while anything above the 4s had a over 40% profit margin.
So i guess, it worked... until it didn't

 

[mkg3]

I just don't see how the 'legacy' car companies can really compete in the EV market. The top 4 EV companies in the world started with ZERO experience building cars. They also started with zero employees, dealerships, factories, suppliers, and retirees. Legacy companies just don't have the expertise or the cost structure to compete against a pure EV venture that doesn't have the burden of supporting multiple obsolete functions and a large retiree base. I think the writing is on the wall...

Agree 100%.

The legacy cost structure and union along with dealership commitments makes it impossible to compete against new pure EV companies with inherently lower costs.

Even when VWAG tries to copy the new business model with Scout, by online orders and no dealerships (e.g., Tesla and Rivian biz model), the legacy VW dealers has them tied up in courts.

 

[Vim Schrotnock]

Well... the same way the chinese did?

German automakers received subsidies also. But instead of using them to sell afforable EVs, at a loss, by compensating with the subsidies, they decided to sell premium EVs with a substantial profit margin and also pocket the subsidies as "R&D expenses".

The strategy seems to have worked well for the chinese. Of course, I can imagine that selling the investors the idea of selling cars at a loss instead of 10-50% profit margin, to capture market and establish a tech moat in the EV world, is not a easy thing to do. But again, the chinese somehow managed.

The market has been begging for afforable cars for a decade, because all you can find in europe is "premium" cars, and when the time to enter the EV market came, all automakers decided: "I know what the people want, more premium cars they can't afford to own!" Big brain strategy And then they held meetings with investors to tell them how difficult the market is, how nobody wants to buy their overprice "premium" junkfor 50% profit margin prices.

Honesly, it's such a basic concept, that only the germans could fail at it, as they fail at most simple non-complicated things. New phone maker enters the market? Sells at a loss, to capture some market and establish a customer base. New tooth brush maker enters the market? Sells at a loss, to capture market. New "bottled air from antartica in a jar" company enters the market? Sells at a loss, to capture market.

Very very very basic concept.

Around 2022, numbers were floting around that the base taycan sells for a 10% profit margin, while anything above the 4s had a over 40% profit margin.
So i guess, it worked... until it didn't

Germany can't do the same thing the Chinese did because the entire country is basically a legacy car manufacturer. In China, their top two EV manufacturers had no experience, and therefore no sunk costs and restructuring to deal with in setting up their EV companies. Same with Tesla. Imagine what would happen if Germany began funding the companies that put their legacy manufacturers out of business...

 

[Sar]

Porsche's Cost-Cutting To Claim Another 5,000 Jobs: Report

Porsche appoints new production chief, reportedly puts more EV projects on hold

Meanwhile, Der Spiegel reports that Michael Leiters, who became Porsche CEO on 1 January 2026, has asked for time until early October to finalise the company’s strategy. According to the report, however, the direction is already becoming clear: Porsche intends to refocus on its roots as a “sports car manufacturer” and define the brand more through exclusive combustion-engine models than through electric vehicles, as it did under former CEO Oliver Blume.

Former CEO Oliver Blume had already postponed the large electric SUV, internally known as the K1, until the 2030s. According to Der Spiegel, Michael Leiters has now also delayed a second project—an all-electric version of the Panamera—”well into the next decade”. The report further states that Porsche is distancing itself from Volkswagen’s software partnership with US electric vehicle manufacturer Rivian.

Overall, the report suggests that Porsche is shifting its focus back towards its traditional strengths. “It feels like we’ve turned back the clock ten years,” Der Spiegel quotes a frustrated developer as saying.

Even ignoring competition, what will they do about emissions regulations?

This is the most shortsighted strategy they could possibly come up with. So deflating. This might be my first and last Porsche.

Instead of navigating the future, they are simply clinging onto the past and will be left to the history books as such.

 

[chun]

Germany can't do the same thing the Chinese did because the entire country is basically a legacy car manufacturer. In China, their top two EV manufacturers had no experience, and therefore no sunk costs and restructuring to deal with in setting up their EV companies. Same with Tesla. Imagine what would happen if Germany began funding the companies that put their legacy manufacturers out of business...

Not all Porsches are made in Germany, and not all VW are made in Germany.

Xpeng manages to make cars in Austria for 45k that charge at 450kw; that have full nappa leather interior, that have big batteries, that handle well, that has great self driving and good software. Hell, they’re the first that decided to pay for google SDK for maps and App Store, all of that in the same 45k

Austria is not exactly a cheap country when it comes to working force.

Just because they are unwilling to take risks is not “unable” to do the same thing Chinese did; it’s “unwilling”.

 

[Tooney]

Supposedly worker representatives and shareholders each hold 50% of the voting power on supervisory boards of Porsche AG and VW Group and a super majority of the board is required to approve major actions.

I don't know what that board structure means for nimble, cost-effective, and profitable decision making.

 

[Tooney]

Porsche Just Raised Its Layoff Total to 8,900. The Growth Rate Is the Real Warning Sign
. . .
Why Layoffs Like This Never Arrive All at Once
Here's the detail most coverage of this story will skip past: restructuring isn't free, and in Germany it's especially not free. Porsche's own CFO told shareholders in March that its recalibration measures would keep weighing on 2026 earnings by hundreds of millions of euros before any savings materialize. Layoffs at a German industrial company don't happen with a same-day notice and a box for your desk photos. They're negotiated, role by role, through a severance framework worked out with the works council, inside a supervisory board that German codetermination law requires to be half-elected by employees. That's exactly why a number like this arrives in installments instead of all at once. Management proposes a figure it can defend publicly. Labor negotiates. The real scope gets found later, at the table. The jump from 3,900 to 8,900 isn't Porsche panicking. It's the negotiation catching up to a plan that was undersized from the start.

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