Porsche expands partnership with Google

[dws_ch]

Interesting news from Porsche regarding PCM:

https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/2023/company/porsche-expansion-partnership-google-34205.html

Porsche and Google are expanding their collaboration with the goal of enabling even deeper integration of Google services in Porsche vehicles.

Porsche will offer Google services for navigation, speech, and app ecosystem in future vehicle generations, and plans to start production in the middle of the decade. This integration of the Google ecosystem will include Google Maps, Google Assistant, and a wide variety of apps available through the Google Play Store. Porsche customers will continue to find the familiar user interface of the Porsche Communication Management (PCM) system, including regular online updates keeping the PCM system up-to-date.

“Our customers fulfil a dream with our vehicles. In addition to timeless design and exceptional performance, they also want a seamless digital experience. This blended ecosystem results from the integration of platforms and apps that customers know from their end devices,” says Oliver Blume, Chairman of the Executive Board of Porsche AG. “We have an open approach and are developing innovations with leading technology partners.”

In the future, ecosystems from different providers that are relevant for customers will be integrated directly into the vehicle via standardized interfaces and platforms. The PCM will thus become an integral part of the digital ecosystem of Porsche customers worldwide, making offering Google built-in a next step for Porsche on this path. The partnership between Porsche and Google is a long-term venture.

“We’re excited to partner with Porsche on their goal to bring innovative and helpful in- vehicle experiences to their customers,“ says Hiroshi Lockheimer, SVP of Platforms and Ecosystems at Google. “With an infotainment experience built on Android, drivers will be able to access the latest Google technologies and services in tandem with the best of Porsche design and branding.”

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[tigerbalm]

One day it's all in on Apple (CarPlay v2) then the next it's Google. Sometimes there is even hints in Microsoft's direction. VW/Porsche infotainment strategy seems to lack focus..

 

[Scandinavian]

One day it's all in on Apple (CarPlay v2) then the next it's Google. Sometimes there is even hints in Microsoft's direction. VW/Porsche infotainment strategy seems to lack focus..

Agree, it all seems desperate actions. But this is just the entertainment system of the car. I am more scared on what all of this says about all the otherSW in the car. To have a system design with 100+ ECU’s does not inspire confidence given the PCM performance

 

[MissionC]

Hopefully more details come out, but I think this is more about Porsche recognizing that (come to find out) software is hard and Apple and Google provide experiences for users far beyond what they can build in-house. This reads to me that like they do with some Apple services, Porsche will build native apps into their existing stack to bring Google experiences (what those are I have no idea other than ads) into the PCM. I believe Porsche has already demoed a full “takeover” of the PCM using Apple’s new CarPlay features and will likely allow the same if a customer has a droid. Given the crazy demographic alignment of Porsche with iPhone users, I doubt this is a shift away from that strategy.

 

[Vercingetorix]

Is that Porsche or is VAG making a corporate decision?

 

[Wovi]

Not too surprised to hear this given the news of Cariad layoffs. I can’t say I’m happy to have Google watching all of my drives though.

 

[Scandinavian]

Hopefully more details come out, but I think this is more about Porsche recognizing that (come to find out) software is hard and Apple and Google provide experiences for users far beyond what they can build in-house. This reads to me that like they do with some Apple services, Porsche will build native apps into their existing stack to bring Google experiences (what those are I have no idea other than ads) into the PCM. I believe Porsche has already demoed a full “takeover” of the PCM using Apple’s new CarPlay features and will likely allow the same if a customer has a droid. Given the crazy demographic alignment of Porsche with iPhone users, I doubt this is a shift away from that strategy.

I have experienced and tried the Google sw in a Polestar a few years ago, and was not impressed by that. Yes the map and navigation was better than Here in the PCM, but nothing to write home about. They may well have updated the sw since.
I would be interested to hear what anyone with recent experience from a Polestar would say?

 

[tigerbalm]

Also worth remembering that the "satellite" view in the current PCM (which is superimposed onto Here mapping data) is currently supplied by Google – and even has their logo on the lower left of the display.

 

[DGW]

They (VW) have been messing up with its own software development for years, and as a result they massively delayed the launch of Macan and Bentley EVs.
partnering with Google is their last resort, but it really depends on how far Porsche will go with it, the best way IMO is Google for infortainment only, keeping/seperating the PCM light and reliable in the backend for car management just like the ECU on ICE cars.

 

[bxwatso]

Any experts with thoughts on existing Taycans running the Google software?
If the hardware is unchanged to accomplish this, I would think it is less expensive to load the new software into existing Taycans rather than support two platforms.

 

[WasserGKuehlt]

Any experts with thoughts on existing Taycans running the Google software?
If the hardware is unchanged to accomplish this, I would think it is less expensive to load the new software into existing Taycans rather than support two platforms.

I'm not an expert (in either Taycans or Google ) but that sounds unlikely to me. Something like CarPlay (or the Google equivalent) is essentially turning the screen into a console/shell that operates the OS of the device/phone. It's a bit more than a mere 'remote' session, as some of the devices or functions of the car are entrusted to the phone's OS (the screen itself, audio source + control, nav).

But this article talks about something else - although it only mentions 'add-on'/plug-in functionality (again nav, audio etc.), in effect the PCM as an OS for the car's "user experience" is being replaced by/with Google's automotive OS, built on an Android platform. It would be possible to retrofit their software on the existing hardware, but sounds expensive, difficult (rollback would need to be solid, so as not to brick the car's infotainment) and with near-0 upside (PCM mostly works, and you'll either buy another Porsche or not irrespective of this migration). Much easier to start with new hardware, which is probably why they mention a 'mid-decade' timeline. A retrofit of that may be possible, but surely won't be free.

jm2c

 

[andb]

New automotive software will take years to be ready even on Android platform.

Until they figure out which direction to go, Porsche must improve the PCM responsiveness and app connection to keep customers happy. All their cars run on this platform for now.

But I think its a hardware problem because everything has 1 second delay, cameras, popups, touch interface, etc

.

 

[new2porsche]

I purchase a 2023 Volvo V60 Polestar, and the UI, Google OS/infotainment system was so bad that I sold the car within 4 months of owning. I know it’s not all on Google (also Volvo’s very poor design and use of their screens) but it was probably one of the worst experiences I’ve seen in a modern (touch screen) car. Absolute garbage and hope if Porsche is partnering with Google they can do it right.

 

[tigerbalm]

But I think its a hardware problem because everything has 1 second delay, cameras, popups, touch interface, etc

A combination of slightly underpowered hardware and an insanely inefficient software architecture.

The PCM uses an architecture (docker) for front-end user computing that neither Windows, macOS, Android or iOS (iPhone or iPad) uses! Nope, they went their own way and decided to make every app you interact with (with one or two exceptions) a docker container.

The advantage for them in this approach is that they can keep each app completely isolated from each other and have each app need their own OS or dependencies.

However, Microsoft/Apple/Google have managed to roll out end-user computing to the entire planet without requiring this approach – which is more suited to server-side microservice architectures.

This means the PCM apps use more memory then they would otherwise require. Additionally there are more layers between the user and the app itself: docker host, container OS, virtualised frame buffers, complex virtualised networking stacks, etc.

Two app's that do not use docker containers (that I am aware of) are: Homelink and reversing camera. And you'll notice how quickly the reversing camera "app" appears when you put your car into reverse gear – and compare that to how quickly "weather" app loads.

So if Porsche would just back away from this software architecture and start using normal end-user computing process isolation/sandboxing techniques that work already across billions of devices – then they could eek a lot more out of the current hardware.

But for some bizarre reason, they are proud of the PCM software architecture – though it only shouts they can't control having a unified approach to developing "apps" for the platform.

What they should do to fix the PCM:

• Remove every app that isn't really required for the Porsche experience. Apps like: News, Weather (maybe), etc. Get the code base down to as small as possible.
• Start porting the key apps like Navigation and Radio/Apple Music/Spotify over to run as "normal" apps on the PCM like Homelink and Reversing Camera does today.
• Remove the docker host layer when all apps have been migrated.
• Accept there won't be an "App Store" for the PCM and that really one isn't required.

 

[WasserGKuehlt]

A combination of slightly underpowered hardware and an insanely inefficient software architecture.

I'm far from being a fan of containers, but this ^ is clearly a subjective opinion; you don't know what they optimized for, and in general, isolation of user software running in a car is a desirable trait.

But for some bizarre reason, they are proud of the PCM software architecture – though it only shouts they can't control having a unified approach to developing "apps" for the platform.

Arguably they shouldn't be in the business of providing an app development platform. I can't fault them for that, although the various descriptions given for the Cariad 'vision' was going exactly in that direction. That is, I'm not sure if the choice not to be a platform was a conscious one, or a point-in-time decision ("we'll do that later").

What they should do to fix the PCM:

• Remove every app that isn't really required for the Porsche experience. Apps like: News, Weather (maybe), etc. Get the code base down to as small as possible.
• Start porting the key apps like Navigation and Radio/Apple Music/Spotify over to run as "normal" apps on the PCM like Homelink and Reversing Camera does today.
• Remove the docker host layer when all apps have been migrated.
• Accept there won't be an "App Store" for the PCM and that really one isn't required.

I'm not disagreeing with some of your points - specifically removing the clutter, and giving up on the app store ambitions. But the rest is an implementation detail, and I think I'd have taken the same containerization path. You can fix a performance issue (re: your initial paragraph about underpowered hw - that's one venue but not the only possibility), but you can't fix a design choice after it becomes a reliability nightmare or a maintenance hell (and very likely, both).

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