Can The Porsche Taycan REALLY Beat The 911? -- Drag Race & Track Battle

[f1eng]

Hm. I asked if you would choose Taycan, and you said “No”…but based on your explanation, i think you should say “yes”, right

Yes, I misread.
Taycan CT suits my requirements perfectly. No 911 model does.
If Porsche do an EV Boxter which isn’t as vast and heavy as 911s have become that may be interesting.

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[WasserGKuehlt]

You misunderstood my point. I wasn’t saying that it would have made economic sense. I meant that the actual design of the car is a two door design they stuck foor doors on, compromising space, ingress and egress. Given the design constraints, it would have been a better car to drive if it had two doors. Of course it wouldn’t sell as well.

Indeed, that didn't come across as clearly. For sure the Mission E made a very dramatic impact design-wise when it was unveiled, exactly as intended. Someone (who might be lurking here) even said he was disappointed with the production model being a bit tamer in its curves and coupe-like shape.
I have minimal time in a Taycan (sat in one once for ~60s), but the CT seems to have addressed the worst of the design's consequences: ingress/egress to/from rear seats. (FWIW, I had no real interest in the sedan, aside from pure curiosity.)

No it’s not just appearance. It’s about how it moves. The Taycan feels and looks like it’s directly connected to the drivers brain. It just moves immediately and linearly, with no drama. The 911, while blisteringly quick, does it with a ton of sound, fury, and drama.

I can fully believe and appreciate that, too; however, that's not something you could have decided from that video you referenced.. No matter, even if the Taycan a better 911, it wasn't meant to be a 911.

 

[tomtom901]

Really? I thought we were the only ones to get a 150% increase in electricity cost.

nah, same here across the pond (Netherlands). Moving up to €0,40-0,50 per kWh at public charging spots. Luckily I can charge at a customers when I’m at their site.

 

[Ipercool]

Really? I thought we were the only ones to get a 150% increase in electricity cost.

Here in Italy too the cost of electricity has enormously increased .
But EV cars don't pay the ownership tax that ices do.
An ICE car of 600hp (440kw), costs almost 10,000 euros per year in ownership tax, an EV of the same power pays 0.

 

[Archimedes]

On the GTS topic, if anyone is looking for one, there is a brand new one for sale on Rennlist right now for sticker.

 

[f1eng]

nah, same here across the pond (Netherlands). Moving up to €0,40-0,50 per kWh at public charging spots. Luckily I can charge at a customers when I’m at their site.

But what is the domestic price you pay at home? Mine more than doubled, I pay around €0.39 per kWh at home and €0.85 per kWh at a fast charger last week.

 

[f1eng]

Weight is certainly the big problem on the track. Colin Chapman discovered this in the 60s in Formula 1.

But the 911 is a lard ass and too heavy to be a true sportscar....stands back and waits for the backlash lol.

I used to own a Lotus Exige 240s supercharged 1.8 VVti. It weighed 935kg. Consequently it was a hoot on the track. Wish I hadn't sold it.

It was already extremely well known well before Colin "discovered" it.

What he did was pushed the bounds of safety further than anybody else chasing weight loss.

I knew him fairly well, we used to go to FIA meetings in Paris together in my early days.
There are some impressive stories from the mechanics, both about cars and some of his eccentricities!
I was told one of the F1 chassis he designed back then wasn't strong enough to carry its own weight and distorted when they first put it on the ground. They then reinforced the bent bits before it first ran, then reinforced the bits that bent or broke when it first ran.
His argument was that you can't tell if a part is heavier than it needs to be by track testing...
There were none of money for the testing equipment or people to use them back then.

To put it in perspective the teams and budgets were small.
When I joined Hesketh Racing permanantly (I was part time at first) we were a total of 18 people, and the race team went to the airport in 2 cars. I joined Williams at the end of 1978 season and we were 23 people, including Frank.

Today the Teams are 700-1000 people and the budgets about 500x greater (yes 500x, maybe more). This has allowed the cars to get much safer.

 

[f1eng]

I used to own a Lotus Exige 240s supercharged 1.8 VVti. It weighed 935kg. Consequently it was a hoot on the track. Wish I hadn't sold it.

I seem to remember the Lotus Elan we built from a "kit", to avoid purchase tax at the time, in the '60s weighed less than 600kg.
It was quicker round a track than an E-Type Jag despite the big power difference.

 

[Kev946]

I seem to remember the Lotus Elan we built from a "kit", to avoid purchase tax at the time, in the '60s weighed less than 600kg.
It was quicker round a track than an E-Type Jag despite the big power difference.

Correct. My Exige was a MK2. I believe the MK1 was around 750kg. No power steering, mid engine and perfect balance. Also small. Absolutely beautiful to drive; a real drivers car. Makes the 911 feel like a big heavy touring car.

 

[f1eng]

Makes the 911 feel like a big heavy touring car.

The 911 wasn’t a big heavy car, though it is now.

 

[tomtom901]

But what is the domestic price you pay at home? Mine more than doubled, I pay around €0.39 per kWh at home and €0.85 per kWh at a fast charger last week.

I had a contract from Sept 2021 to Sept 2022 for 0,15 per kWh, now the prices are around 0,60 per kWh (domestic). Fast charger is I think around 0.85 as well, don't use them. 99% of my charging is at 11 kWh which are around 0,30-0,40.

 

[Kev946]

The 911 wasn’t a big heavy car, though it is now.

Exactly, hardly progress. Too many crumple zone, air bags, electric windows etc etc

 

[kurand]

I run a 23 year old mk1 Lotus Elise for my ICE fix. It weighs a measured 715Kg, 220hp and no power anything not even servo brake. It is mid(ish) engined but hardly perfectly balanced with a 38/62 weight split and has some interesting liftoff oversteer characteristics. it makes a wonderful alternative to modern over weight/sized cars but it can be fairly intimidating driving such a small car on public roads these days.

 

[Sidicks]

Perfect garage for me will be the Taycan GTS for daily use and a 911 GT3 for weekend fun and touring.

 

[f1eng]

Perfect garage for me will be the Taycan GTS for daily use and a 911 GT3 for weekend fun and touring.

I have my perfect garage. CT4S and 6-speed manual Ferrari 355 spider for fun.
I chose the Ferrari over a 911 25 years ago (bought new) and nothing that has come out since has appealed to me enough to swap it

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