EA charging

[SteveTaycan101]

This sounds about right to me. You should see about 100kW if you plug in at 5x%

As for the EV 350 kw charger, if 4.3 miles/minute is considered slow, would speed should I expect given that I have the Performance Battery Plus and On-Board 150kw/400V DC Charger installed?

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[Jhenson29]

As for the EV 350 kw charger, if 4.3 miles/minute is considered slow, would speed should I expect given that I have the Performance Battery Plus and On-Board 150kw/400V DC Charger installed?

A couple of things.

1) 350kW stations are 800VDC and not relevant for the 150kW/400VDC charger (different voltage). All Taycans can charge up to a maximum of 270kW at the 350kW stations.

2) Miles/minute isn’t the best metric for charge rate as it’s dependent on efficiency.

That said, most owners are in the ballpark of 3mi/kWh.

So, using that, 270kW divided by 60 min is 4.5 kWh/min times 3 miles/kWh is 13.5 miles/minute.

150kW would be 7.5 miles/minute using the same math (kW/20).

Those are peak numbers.

 

[SteveTaycan101]

A couple of things.

1) 350kW stations are 800VDC and not relevant for the 150kW/400VDC charger (different voltage). All Taycans can charge up to a maximum of 270kW at the 350kW stations.

2) Miles/minute isn’t the best metric for charge rate as it’s dependent on efficiency.

That said, most owners are in the ballpark of 3mi/kWh.

So, using that, 270kW divided by 60 min is 4.5 kWh/min times 3 miles/kWh is 13.5 miles/minute.

150kW would be 7.5 miles/minute using the same math (kW/20).

Those are peak numbers.

Thanks. My conclusion is, therefore, that the car is not receiving, for some reason, the kwh at the rate it is capable of. A trip to the dealer is next.

 

[daveo4EV]

Thanks. My conclusion is, therefore, that the car is not receiving, for some reason, the kwh at the rate it is capable of. A trip to the dealer is next.

good luck with that - as to why a particular charging session does not yield maximum results there are tooooooooo many variables…

• power available at the charger at that moment in time
• is the charge station running hotter because it finished a high powered session just before you plugged in - so it's thermally limited at that moment due to prior usage
• ambient air temperature
• temperature of the vehicle battery
• voltage at the charging site
• were the charging sites peak load batteries full or empty?
• SOC of the vehicle battery
• battery age and total usage…
• limitations on maximum charge rate due to power load metrics required by the local power grid company
• software bugs in the vehicle or charger that for some reason led to the charger and vehicle negotiating a slow charge session.
• just to name a few…there are many many many more variables to fast charge rate limitations

the published charge rate for any/all EV's are what _CAN_ be achieved, not what _WILL_ be achieved in all circumstances. Optimal charge rates (the published specs) require ideal circumstances and require all factors to "align" including ambient temperature/weather condtions and optimal power grid and charging station behaviors and capacities. see the above list of factors for a partial set of variables all of which can lessen charge rates to below optimal.

your dealer will not be able to diagnose diddly squat - because they have no idea how all this works, and honestly there is nothing for them to "fix", and they will not be able to recreate the situation or circumstances that lead to that charge rate at that specific charger at that time of day for that battery SOC and temperature…

the ONLY thing a dealer can diagnose is:

• does the fastDC on board charger work or not work
• _IF_ the problem is 100% reproducible at a local fast charger and is considered abnormally "slow" - they might find some problem to fix - but that's a rare and uncommon experience
• also to actually diagnose fast charging problems requires active monitoring and charger session log data during the charging session from the charging site vendor - so you can determine if the charge rate limitation is due to the vehicle or charger or current electrical grid conditions throttling power to avoid overloading the power grid…
• so your dealer is going to call EA and corridinate with them to diagnose a particluar charge session rate when/how/in-what-universe?

the upshot is you will never know why you get the charge rate you do for any particular charging session because you do not control all the variables, and do not have access to both the charger logs and vehicle logs to see where/why the charge rate is what it is.

NOTE ACTUAL FACTUAL EXPERIENCE FROM MARCH OF 2022: at the 10/12 stall EA station in livermore, ca - I plugged in to one of the 4 working (8 were offline) EA stalls and was receiving 52-68 kW charge rate - well below expectations - I decided to change stalls to one of the other 4 working stalls - and volia I immediately was receiving in excess of 120 kW charge rate…why did the other station only provide 52-68 kW?? We will never know, because we lack log data from the station to diagnose what the limitation was…

Just because you did not get maximum charge rate does not mean there is an actual problem that can be fixed - it may have been the maximum that can be achieved given those exact circumstances.

the published maximum charge rate is the ideal charge rate in ideal conditions - your charge rate may vary is a _FACT_ of EV ownership.

this is true for all EV's regardless of manufacturer.

charge rates for EV are like a box of chocolates - you never know what'cha gonna get…

99.9% of the time "slow" rate of charge are for one of three reasons:

1. the particluar charging station/site is limited/slow for some reason you will never know about or can fix
2. your vehicle battery temperature is too low or too high
3. your vehicle battery SOC (% of charge) is too high for optimal charge rate

very very very rarely (0.0000023% of the time) does a slow fast charging session indicate a problem/defect with the vehicle that requires repair (or could even be diagnosed).

 

[daveo4EV]

Thanks. My conclusion is, therefore, that the car is not receiving, for some reason, the kwh at the rate it is capable of. A trip to the dealer is next.

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...my-taycan-charge-as-fast-as-i-want-it-to.779/

 

[daveo4EV]

oh and let's not forget - EA is a 100% "sh*t show" and they simply suck at what they do - their stations suck, their charge rates such and if you're having a slow charge at EA that's normally standard operating procedure and they simply suck at what they do and are completely uninterested in determining how they can be better.

Q: why does my Taycan charge so slowly?
A: are you charging at an EA site?
A: why yes, yes I am charging at an EA site
A: you've answered your own question…

 

[DerekS]

Thanks. My conclusion is, therefore, that the car is not receiving, for some reason, the kwh at the rate it is capable of. A trip to the dealer is next.

You will frustrate yourself doing this. I agree with Dave's lengthy post; there are many variables and there is almost certainly nothing that needs fixing.

If you want to confirm your car is performing as advertised with regard to charging speed, I get it - I did this too when I got the car.

Here is my recommendation:

• Find a nearby EA station rated well on PlugShare
• Add it as a GPS destination so the car will prewarm the battery
• Arrive with < 10% charge (ideally 5%)
• Ensure "Optimized charging" is NOT checked
• Plug into one of the 350kW pumps

You will see ~265kW or so at the start of the charge, and you will see it taper off over time.

 

[DerekS]

Also, review this charging curve - you only get that full speed for the first 25%, there are several points where it ramps down (and after 80% ramps down pretty severely.)

https://insideevs.com/news/427335/porsche-taycan-dc-charging-test/

 

[Jhenson29]

Thanks. My conclusion is, therefore, that the car is not receiving, for some reason, the kwh at the rate it is capable of. A trip to the dealer is next.

As others have said, there are lots of reasons to not hit the peak numbers. My post wasn’t to suggest that there is an issue with your car if you have lower charge rates. It was only trying to help you with general calculations.

 

[SteveTaycan101]

Thanks all for the suggestions and reassurances. As Derek S suggested, I will be sure that Optimized Charging is NOT checked on the PCM.

 

[Davy021]

Does it stop charging at 30 mins on its own or do we have to keep an eye on it and stop at 30 mins ourselves?

 

[DerekS]

Does it stop charging at 30 mins on its own or do we have to keep an eye on it and stop at 30 mins ourselves?

You have to stop it. Most trips you won't need more than 30 mins anyway, but if you do it's so cheap I'm willing to let it charge me.

 

[JRNJTAYCAN]

I have had my car for just under 4 weeks now and only use EA chargers. The one near me is pretty crappy so I have to do back to back charging. As long as I stay under 30 minutes and disconnect I have not been charged.
I used a different station for the first time this weekend and only needed the 30 minute session to charge.

 

[Pozuelo]

• Ensure "Optimized charging" is NOT checked

I don’t understand why, because it refers to AC charging… Mine always charges at full power with it marked, except on rare occasions when a charger might have issues. I just try another one if it is available.

 

[daveo4EV]

I don’t understand why, because it refers to AC charging… Mine always charges at full power with it marked, except on rare occasions when a charger might have issues. I just try another one if it is available.

optimized charging only effects fast dc charging - not L2 AC charging which maxes out at 19.2 kw in north america - 19.2 kw is not much of a load on a 93 kwh battery

fast dc charging maxes out at 270 kw and optimized charging limits that to 200 kw to place less charging load on the battery to improve battery longevity

fast dc charging also ignore any charging schedules