What happened to the 19.2 KW AC on board charger option ?

[Mike in CA]

After reading this thread I'm glad I didn't opt for the 19.2kW charger. My thought was that the existing 9.6kW unit plugged into a 50A circuit in my garage was perfectly adequate for my charging needs. Finding out that significant electrical work would be required to use the optional 19.2kW unit just reinforced my choice, not to mention the fact that it apparently wouldn't have made it into my build anyway.

OTOH, I'm a little sorry that I optioned the 400V/150kW DC upgrade since after reading @daveo4EV's posts it sounds like I will likely get little return on my $460.

Anyway, thanks to all for the explanations.

Sponsored

 

[daveo4EV]

By George, I think I've got it now! I have a 50amp 10-50 plug at home using 6AWG left over from my Chevy Volt days, and feel no need to go beyond that.

you are correct - your 10-50 plug will be great and should charge your Taycan @ 9.6 kW if you have a 40 amp EVSE (50 amp breaker)

but 6 gauge AWG can support a 60 amp breaker -swap the breaker and install a ClipperCreek HCS-60 - hardwire the ClipperCreek charger into the box where your current 10-50 plug is - and you can charge your factory stock Taycan at home at 11 kW instead of 9.6 kW…

the ClipperCreek will also charge your Volt, but no faster than previously cause the limit is the charge rate of the Volt - but it will work fine.

but that is entirely optional.

 

[daveo4EV]

By George, I think I've got it now! I have a 50amp 10-50 plug at home using 6AWG left over from my Chevy Volt days, and feel no need to go beyond that. And since Porsche has dropped the 22KW(19.2KW) charger, that leaves the 400V 150KW unit, for which I will check that box! Man, I too would be lost without all your help. Thank you all again!

I am curious - the most common 50 amp plugs in North America are NEMA 14-50 & NEMA 6-50 - do you actually have a. NEMA 10-50 plug (see pic below)?

NEMA 1-50 is a two-hots & ground - 3 blades - and can be easily swapped for a more common NEMA 6-50 plug - Porsche does not provide a NEMA 10-50 cable option for their EVSE - but they do offer either a NEMA 14-50 or NEMA 6-50 supply cable for their EVSE's

although if you do have a NEMA 10-50 a high quality 10-50 to 6-50 adapter from Amazon would be no problem because both plugs are 50 amp rated and the same number of connectors and wires…

anyways it's easier to find NEMA 14-50 & 6-50 EVSE's than 10-50 EVSE's but adapters are easy and cheap.

 

[Pwh819]

My build starts this week and when I went to myPorsche to get an update saw that the 19.2 kW AC On-Board Charger is not available and was taken out of my configuration. Not sure its a big deal to me but my dealer insisted that it was worth it?

 

[daveo4EV]

Not sure its a big deal to me but my dealer insisted that it was worth it?

i’m highly confident your dealer doesn’t know what they are talking about.

useful where and when? what 100/80 amp chargers are you likely to encounter in your travels?

• are you provisioning a 100 amp circuit for your garage at home?
  • and a 80/100 amp Ev charger?
• your work has an 80 amp charger?
• businesses you frequent?

no doubt it’s great when you find an 80 amp charger while traveling - but they are not common - and if you do find one I’ll betcha it’s a Tesla one and you’ll need a TeslaTap to use it - not a bad thing...teslataps or similar are must have for any EV owner traveling away from home

Tesla 80 amp chargers are rare birds
pure standard j-1772 80 amp chargers even rarer!

lol - betcha your dealer only has a 40 amp J-1772 charger - can’t even test 19.2 kW charging at a porsche dealer!

ask your dealer if you can test it out with their charger prior to delivery to verify it works - watch them stare at their feet upon that request - if they say yes no problem - make sure it’s with the drivers side charging port / you know the one that isn’t CCS - if it charges at 19.2 kw in that port - hats off to the dealer for having an 80 amp EVSE J-1772 charger installed at the dealership! rare bird!

 

[andrewket]

My 2021 Turbo with 19.2kW charger is in production now. It started on 3/2, so it should be done soon. The 19.2kW charger is important to me, as previously stated on a few other threads here (TOU EV plan with 3 EVs). I already have the infrastructure at home to support it, so despite the insane price tag on the option, it's a marginal cost to me as I've already sunk thousands into electrical upgrades (btw, I did most of it at the same time as my solar system which made them eligible for a 30% fed tax credit in the USA.)

Losing plug and charge because of the 19.2kW on board AC charger is crazy. Seriously crazy that such a dependency exists, and bat sh*t crazy that Porsche didn't figure this out in testing. Then to say the 'fix' will only come with MY22 cars? Are you nuts? Hello OTA software update?

I checked with my dealer last week who said the charger hasn't been removed from my order and he has heard nothing about the feature being removed or problems with it. If I'm going to permanently lose plug and charge, I don't know what I'm going to do. I road trip and use DC chargers a lot. Besides the PITA of having to use an app each time, I'd put money on EA/Porsche improving the plug and charge experience so that it is 99% reliable, and then they'll stop paying attention to the app experience. So instead of just an annoyance it becomes a real problem.

Edit: Track my dream just reported my car is ready for transport

Edit: Called my dealer/sales rep again. He read the notice. Yes, the feature has been hidden from the configurator. Yes, cars already ordered with 19.2kW will be built that way. Yes, it breaks Plug and Charge, and it's a hardware problem(!!) - meaning, no possibility of a software update fixing it?! Porsche said they would provide the remedy in a few days. I told my dealer I'm not taking delivery unless Porsche can fix it on my car. The notice didn't say anything about MY22. I'd be curious who heard that tid bit and the source.

Meanwhile, I've already sold my Tesla Model S and purchased a set of winter wheels and tires.

 

[Mysta]

My 2021 Turbo with 19.2kW charger is in production now. It started on 3/2, so it should be done soon. The 19.2kW charger is important to me, as previously stated on a few other threads here (TOU EV plan with 3 EVs). I already have the infrastructure at home to support it, so despite the insane price tag on the option, it's a marginal cost to me as I've already sunk thousands into electrical upgrades (btw, I did most of it at the same time as my solar system which made them eligible for a 30% fed tax credit in the USA.)

Losing plug and charge because of the 19.2kW on board AC charger is crazy. Seriously crazy that such a dependency exists, and bat sh*t crazy that Porsche didn't figure this out in testing. Then to say the 'fix' will only come with MY22 cars? Are you nuts? Hello OTA software update?

I checked with my dealer last week who said the charger hasn't been removed from my order and he has heard nothing about the feature being removed or problems with it. If I'm going to permanently lose plug and charge, I don't know what I'm going to do. I road trip and use DC chargers a lot. Besides the PITA of having to use an app each time, I'd put money on EA/Porsche improving the plug and charge experience so that it is 99% reliable, and then they'll stop paying attention to the app experience. So instead of just an annoyance it becomes a real problem.

Edit: Track my dream just reported my car is ready for transport

Edit: Called my dealer/sales rep again. He read the notice. Yes, the feature has been hidden from the configurator. Yes, cars already ordered with 19.2kW will be built that way. Yes, it breaks Plug and Charge, and it's a hardware problem(!!) - meaning, no possibility of a software update fixing it?! Porsche said they would provide the remedy in a few days. I told my dealer I'm not taking delivery unless Porsche can fix it on my car. The notice didn't say anything about MY22. I'd be curious who heard that tid bit and the source.

Meanwhile, I've already sold my Tesla Model S and purchased a set of winter wheels and tires.

Little off topic, what made you swap from model s? I’ve had a 3P/pX in past and am comparing against plaid plus for the range.

 

[tigerbalm]

the dealership in their current model provide very very little extra value beyond a delivery portal - the whole industry needs to be reset because of EV's - Tesla realized this like Apple did when they set up their own stores - the EV transition is going to be brutal - and the up-ending of the current dealership models is just the tip of the iceberg

https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/202...rsche-studio-concept-hanoi-vietnam-23746.html

This feels like Porsche dipping their toes into the Apple store retail model. Just an early nod to the future of direct sales. Starting by having no sales at all.

 

[andrewket]

This is what my config looks like now on track my dream. At first it looked like the 19.2kW charger disappeared, but I noticed the MSRP total was the same. Looking again, the option code is there (KB4) but the description has been removed.

 

[rbt3]

you are correct - your 10-50 plug will be great and should charge your Taycan @ 9.6 kW if you have a 40 amp EVSE (50 amp breaker)

but 6 gauge AWG can support a 60 amp breaker -swap the breaker and install a ClipperCreek HCS-60 - hardwire the ClipperCreek charger into the box where your current 10-50 plug is - and you can charge your factory stock Taycan at home at 11 kW instead of 9.6 kW…

the ClipperCreek will also charge your Volt, but no faster than previously cause the limit is the charge rate of the Volt - but it will work fine.

but that is entirely optional.

Thanks again Dave for the explanation of the charging infrastructure in North America and charge options on the Taycan. The dealers/salespeople are definitely not as knowledgable about these issues as they need to be and are telling people anything to get them to purchase and be on their way I feel at times. I was lucky to find out my 2 year old home has upgraded wire and electrical capacity and am currently installing a Tesla Gen 3 Wall charger along with my NEMA 14-50 plug in 1 garage, and a Clipper Creek HCS-60 in my second garage. This should serve all my future EV home charging needs for awhile. I spec'd the 400V/150kW upgrade and would have spec'd the 19.2 kW charger if it was available for 2020, and I agree with you that Porsche should have just made all of these items standard. Just give us all the fastest options available that we may need for charging from the start. I have a Rivian RS-1 order hopefully coming soon, and hopefully they don't "nickel and dime" me over charging capabilities in that vehicle. The tax credit in the US will slowly phase out soon for charging and solar additions to your home, so anyone thinking about these upgrades may want to look into them sooner rather than later.

 

[jimithing]

This is what my config looks like now on track my dream. At first it looked like the 19.2kW charger disappeared, but I noticed the MSRP total was the same. Looking again, the option code is there (KB4) but the description has been removed.

Mine got on the Goodwood on 3/5, headed for Baltimore, and shows exactly the same as yours (option code, no description). Ugh.

 

[andrewket]

Mine got on the Goodwood on 3/5, headed for Baltimore, and shows exactly the same as yours (option code, no description). Ugh.

Should we rename it?

Plug and Charge delete (KB4)

I’m trying to remain hopeful that Porsche will determine they can fix it in software, and commit to doing so within a reasonable time frame. If they can’t do that, commit in writing to replacing the faulty hardware within a reasonable time. I fear “a fix will be implemented in MY22” answer is coming, with no commitment to fix MY21. Both features are important to me, enough to walk away.

What Porsche does here will signal what customers should expect from the brand. Ultra premium pricing should come with ultra premium service and support, otherwise I should just stay with Tesla.

 

[daveo4EV]

ultra premium features and servicer require a company that is stable and on top of their game

with regards to EV’s evidence I’ve observed suggests VW/Porsche/Audi are still a bit back on their heels - for one even _IF_ it can be fixed in software, it’s pretty clear to me that software cycles are elongated - proably do to the complexity of integration testing given that they do not control their entire software stack…

Porsche is doing an OK job with regards to their first EV, but it’s clear to me mastery isn’t yet their thing in this space…

the most likely outcome is MY’2022 fix

and if you consider Tesla over concrete build quality issues more power to you - I’ve never had a problem with Tesla service, sure they suck but who doesn’t - but the build quality grates on me daily - but they are undeniably quick, good value for money given how quick they are, and their charging network is 2nd to none…there is a lot to like

frankly while this is undeniably a screw up- Porsche seems upfront and honest about it once they understood their situation - and also fast charging isn’t a daily use case (at least for me or most people) - so while plug and charger _IS_ dead w/19.2 kW chargers - 4 year life of the car - 15 fast charging sessions a year - so you’d walk away from the vehicle because you’ll have to use an app to activate charging maybe 60 times in the course of your personal ownership? hmmm seems an interesting trade off

personally I’d rip them for a really really nice discount (money in your pocket) or a full range of “free” accessories - having to use an app to activaate charging 60 times or less in the next 4 years - yeah that’s not that big a deal IMHO -but we all have our priorities.

 

[andrewket]

ultra premium features and servicer require a company that is stable and on top of their game

with regards to EV’s evidence I’ve observed suggests VW/Porsche/Audi are still a bit back on their heels - for one even _IF_ it can be fixed in software, it’s pretty clear to me that software cycles are elongated - proably do to the complexity of integration testing given that they do not control their entire software stack…

Porsche is doing an OK job with regards to their first EV, but it’s clear to me mastery isn’t yet their thing in this space…

the most likely outcome is MY’2022 fix

and if you consider Tesla over concrete build quality issues more power to you - I’ve never had a problem with Tesla service, sure they suck but who doesn’t - but the build quality grates on me daily - but they are undeniably quick, good value for money given how quick they are, and their charging network is 2nd to none…there is a lot to like

frankly while this is undeniably a screw up- Porsche seems upfront and honest about it once they understood their situation - and also fast charging isn’t a daily use case (at least for me or most people) - so while plug and charger _IS_ dead w/19.2 kW chargers - 4 year life of the car - 15 fast charging sessions a year - so you’d walk away from the vehicle because you’ll have to use an app to activate charging maybe 60 times in the course of your personal ownership? hmmm seems an interesting trade off

personally I’d rip them for a really really nice discount (money in your pocket) or a full range of “free” accessories - having to use an app to activaate charging 60 times or less in the next 4 years - yeah that’s not that big a deal IMHO -but we all have our priorities.

I take a lot of road trips. I may use DC fast charging 60 times a year. My concern is less about the time and hassle, but rather the larger potential (and in my mind, likely) implication. We know there are still handshake issues between Porsche and EA. I’m concerned that once plug and charge is common that both Porsche and EA will stop spending any time on improving the app / handshake experience when using the app. I say this with an engineering, software development, and product background with a major technology company. The likelihood that a product manager will decide “it’s good enough” for the small and continuing to dwindle “non plug and charge” population and decide to focus resources on continuing to improve the experience for the growing population is high.

Said another way...

I might be OK if it meant a consistent extra 20-30 seconds at each charge stop. I’m not OK if it’s the difference of 2-10 min per stop, or the risk of not charging at all.

If the answer is MY22 then transfer my deposit, negotiated discount, and give me an early MY22 allocation.

 

[Jhenson29]

We know there are still handshake issues between Porsche and EA. I’m concerned that once plug and charge is common that both Porsche and EA will stop spending any time on improving the app / handshake experience when using the app.

I’ll preface this with the fact that I’m speaking having never used the app or public charging.
Does anyone know what the actual issue is? If it’s handshaking between Porsche and EA, then I would assume a similar handshake has to take place via Plug and Charge and they would use a common backend for that. Is that not the case? Is there something very specific to the app that is concerning?

Sponsored