[Updated] My Porsche App updated w/ new interface and functions

[WasserGKuehlt]

They could collect ADDITIONAL data from external sources if available, but the primary source should be car logs, with the additional data complementing the car's log.

At least that is how I would have architected the system, simpler, less likely to fail.

Seems we were replying at the same time - and in opposite directions, not that I'd expected anything else. ?

I'm genuinely curious - upon transferring the ownership of a Tesla, would the new owner have access to past charging history? Conversely, would the previous owner still have access to the charging log of their former car - whether before or after the time of transfer?

Sponsored

 

[allsideswater]

Probably a bug but ever since the update I noticed that the 3 free years of charging at Electrify America is showing an expiration of Jan 1 2100. Curious to see what it shows for others?

 

[WasserGKuehlt]

Probably a bug but ever since the update I noticed that the 3 free years of charging at Electrify America is showing an expiration of Jan 1 2100. Curious to see what it shows for others?

Same.

 

[whitex]

I'm genuinely curious - upon transferring the ownership of a Tesla, would the new owner have access to past charging history? Conversely, would the previous owner still have access to the charging log of their former car - whether before or after the time of transfer?

I had 4 Teslas, never had access to old data after unlinking. Never tried hacking it (like keeping old links) but generally Tesla online services were secured better than most.

 

[whitex]

Seems we were replying at the same time - and in opposite directions, not that I'd expected anything else. ?

A lively debate is good for the brain. I know I appreciate it. We all can learn from each other by being exposed to opposite arguments or even different points of view on the same problem.

I can't fault Porsche for optimizing for their ecosystem of chargers/EVSEs/cars (but I can still whine a bit about not being able to dload a charging log directly from the car).

Well, then either:

1. they assumed no Porsche will ever charge at a non-Porsche EVSE at home or at destination chargers
2. they assumed they will take over the EVSE world, replacing almost every single unit accessible to any Porsche in the world, with a Porsche EVSE
3. they assumed users only care about home charging, and not work or travel charging (note that this is not just EVSE, as during travels you can also charge at non-EA locations which will not show up in your Porsche charging log)

All 3 are bad assumptions. Personally I suspect they didn't think that far at all. Some marketing person came up with "charging stats" feature checkbox, some contractor implemented whatever to just put a checkmark in that box. I've seen too much of this at large companies.

 

[WasserGKuehlt]

Well, if that was their assumption, then either:

1. they assumed no Porsche will ever charge at a non-Porsche EVSE at home or at destination chargers
2. they assumed they will take over the EVSE world, replacing almost every single unit accessible to any Porsche in the world, with a Porsche EVSE
3. they assumed users only care about home charging, and not work or travel charging (note that this is not just EVSE, as during travels you can also charge at non-EA locations which will not show up in your Porsche charging log)

All 3 are bad assumptions. Personally I suspect they didn't think that far at all. Some marketing person came up with "charging stats" feature checkbox, some contractor implemented whatever to just put a checkmark in that box. I've seen too much of this at large companies.

I think 3 is most likely (80/20 rule, yes?) + optimizing for effort: you get to see "invoices" from DC charging (in which Porsche participates as a party to the transaction) and charging session from "optimized" EVSE equipment* (which need no user configuration or standardized API/implementation). In both cases, it's charger-side logs, and they cover the needs of the typical/hypothetical Porsche customer. (The one whose electric toothbrush is also styled by Porsche Design, and made in Zuffenhausen.)(Not that one, the one in TX.)

Conversely, while I am certain the car keeps a charging log, pushing it out to a server is far harder work for negligible additional benefit. To begin with, you'd need a reliable OTA update mechanism - and the jury is still out on that one.

*not optimized for amperage, I hasten to add.

 

[snstevens]

Same.

JACKPOT!!!

 

[WasserGKuehlt]

JACKPOT!!!

??‍
@allsideswater is a co-winner.

“You get 76 years of free EA charging!” “You get 76 years of free EA charging!”
“Everyone gets free EA charging forever - so you’ll have time to wait, charging at 10kW.”

 

[B61]

Probably a bug but ever since the update I noticed that the 3 free years of charging at Electrify America is showing an expiration of Jan 1 2100. Curious to see what it shows for others?

Same here…even if i’m in Europe and we don;t have 3 free years at all.

 

[andix]

You can certainly open/ close the car from the app.

 

[whitex]

I think 3 is most likely (80/20 rule, yes?) + optimizing for effort: you get to see "invoices" from DC charging (in which Porsche participates as a party to the transaction) and charging session from "optimized" EVSE equipment* (which need no user configuration or standardized API/implementation). In both cases, it's charger-side logs, and they cover the needs of the typical/hypothetical Porsche customer. (The one whose electric toothbrush is also styled by Porsche Design, and made in Zuffenhausen.)(Not that one, the one in TX.)

I seriously doubt even Porsche assumed 80% of Taycan owners will be using PMCC or the PWCC, since by default they ship Taycans with PMC+ which does not have internet access. Furthermore, now that they are confiscating 240V cables from all PMCC's, that would tank whatever percentage of people using them (assuming the guy with Porsche toothbrush just goes with the flow and agrees to the recall campaign, unless his house burned down already with the Taycan in the garage - that still brings down the percentage of in-ecosystem home charging).

I do think you might be onto something with the DC charging billing statement feature. Perhaps the PMCC guys just rode along on top of DC charging billing feature. So instead of having PMCC have its own section in the app (or its own app), they just wedged it into the DC charging billing statements. I suspect like with so many Porsche software feature, nobody thought of the end-to-end user experience, just put a checkmark next to some marketing feature with least effort (for which code reuse qualifies).

Tesla has in-car charging logs available in the app. They since released EVSE app integration with the Tesla app, but I don't know exactly how they tied it into the user experience in the app - do they associate car logs with EVSE logs, of just have a separate tab for EVSE logs vs. car logs. Since I don't have a Tesla car nor their Gen3 Wall connector which supports it, I don't know what the user experience is. Just off the top of my head a separate tab for EVSE showing all charging sessions for all cars which plug-in would make most sense, with entries which overlap with the car log interlinked between EVSE logs and car logs, so for example you can see the charging losses in the car charging log if using one of your own Tesla EVSEs. Bonus feature would be if your Tesla charges at someone else's Tesla EVSE (say your friend's house or a Tesla destination charger at a hotel), to still correlate the charging entries, but of course without giving you the access to all other charging entries from that EVSE. Perhaps @daveo4EV knows how it works, as he has Tesla Gen3 EVSEs and uses them to charge Taycan and other cars, including Teslas.

 

[whitex]

You can certainly open/ close the car from the app.

With great delays, making the feature so much less useful. Also, no way to start (and drive) the car with the app. I know, I'm spoiled by Tesla car app which has had these useful features for over a decade now.

 

[whitex]

Conversely, while I am certain the car keeps a charging log, pushing it out to a server is far harder work for negligible additional benefit. To begin with, you'd need a reliable OTA update mechanism - and the jury is still out on that one.

I wouldn't be so sure. The car definitely keeps track of totals, time and KWh charged on AC as well as DC, but I wouldn't bet any money on actual logging of every charge session. Porsche is very "frugal" and they don't want to put in any additional memory or storage into the car which they don't have to, even if it was just another $1. Look at PCM, not even enough RAM to run all the apps, and swapping them in/out of emmc is noticeably slow if you run many PCM apps - hence I don't. I mostly just use CarPlay, but even in that case sometimes when I hit Climate menu it takes unusually long to pop up on the screen - I suspect if I don't use Climate menu a lot they swap it out, or reboot sometime when car is parked and never pre-load the app until the first time I hit CLIMATE.

 

[whitex]

've made this point in the past, apologies for sounding like a broken record. The app/website reports energy delivered to the motors*, and also "electric distance" - ie distance covered with motors actually energized. I concluded the delta in energy consumption was spent on heating/conditioning the cabin or the battery, as well as any auxiliary consumers.

Why then do short trips report so much more energy usage, and preheating the cabin makes the first mile even higher?

 

[daveo4EV]

I seriously doubt even Porsche assumed 80% of Taycan owners will be using PMCC or the PWCC, since by default they ship Taycans with PMC+ which does not have internet access. Furthermore, now that they are confiscating 240V cables from all PMCC's, that would tank whatever percentage of people using them (assuming the guy with Porsche toothbrush just goes with the flow and agrees to the recall campaign, unless his house burned down already with the Taycan in the garage - that still brings down the percentage of in-ecosystem home charging).

I do think you might be onto something with the DC charging billing statement feature. Perhaps the PMCC guys just rode along on top of DC charging billing feature. So instead of having PMCC have its own section in the app (or its own app), they just wedged it into the DC charging billing statements. I suspect like with so many Porsche software feature, nobody thought of the end-to-end user experience, just put a checkmark next to some marketing feature with least effort (for which code reuse qualifies).

Tesla has in-car charging logs available in the app. They since released EVSE app integration with the Tesla app, but I don't know exactly how they tied it into the user experience in the app - do they associate car logs with EVSE logs, of just have a separate tab for EVSE logs vs. car logs. Since I don't have a Tesla car nor their Gen3 Wall connector which supports it, I don't know what the user experience is. Just off the top of my head a separate tab for EVSE showing all charging sessions for all cars which plug-in would make most sense, with entries which overlap with the car log interlinked between EVSE logs and car logs, so for example you can see the charging losses in the car charging log if using one of your own Tesla EVSEs. Bonus feature would be if your Tesla charges at someone else's Tesla EVSE (say your friend's house or a Tesla destination charger at a hotel), to still correlate the charging entries, but of course without giving you the access to all other charging entries from that EVSE. Perhaps @daveo4EV knows how it works, as he has Tesla Gen3 EVSEs and uses them to charge Taycan and other cars, including Teslas.

there is no-correlation of EVSE charging logs w/vehicle charging that I've seen/experienced - the Tesla EVSE logs just report "raw" charging sessions - duration and total kWh's…it's as simple as simple can be…you'd have to sit in the car and view any "in car" charging logs and manually find the same entry in the EVSE logs to see what there are for any differences - I do not currently have a Tesla - but have some in my family but they are not easily accessable to me - I'll check it out more thoroughly when my son visits next…

I've included a screen shot from the Tesla.app for a Tesla Gen3 EVSE charging log - based on the kWh amounts I think this is the one I primarily use w/2021 Cayenne eHybrid - very few kWh's and charging times not restricted to "off peak" (small battery I suffer the cost of "peak" rates in order to keep the Hybrid topped off when possible)

there is no integration between vehicle & EVSE that I've observed - but I might be missing something.

Sponsored