Taycan real world Range

MissionC

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Just for the record, the Taycan lap was done in a private session with a professional test driver. The Model 3 lap was done in a public session with an owner driving the car. How many deposit holders here think they can turn a 7:42 in their Taycan?
The real question is why Tesla, who indexes on performance claims for 0-60 times, hasn’t after all this time rented the ‘ring and put a professional driver in their cars and made a documented run? They’ve labeled cars “Performance” and enabled Ludicrous mode, so why not run one like other car manufacturers on the ‘ring?





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felixtb

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many reasons. Tow of them are that the first car they have talked about as trackable is the Model 3 Performance. They have never spent a dime on marketing. And renting a track to do performance tests is just that, marketing. But who cares. We are here to talk about the excitement of the new Taycan!!!!! Not what TESLA has or has not done or will do..... That's for the TESLA MOTORS CLUB forum. Really good by the way, for all that's TESLA. :)
 

tommyb321

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They have never spent a dime on marketing.
That's one of those bullshit claims you often see repeated on Tesla promoting channels.

Sure, they don't do traditional (direct) marketing like ads, instead they essentially pay their customers (and many EV related media) to promote their product through the "referral" schemes. Virtually none of them disclose the fact that using their referral code potentially earns them more than just the free supercharger miles.

It's truly brilliant in a way, as they can't really be held responsible for false advertising done "independently" by their customers.
 

MissionC

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That's one of those bullshit claims you often see repeated on Tesla promoting channels.

Sure, they don't do traditional (direct) marketing like ads, instead they essentially pay their customers (and many EV related media) to promote their product through the "referral" schemes. Virtually none of them disclose the fact that using their referral code potentially earns them more than just the free supercharger miles.

It's truly brilliant in a way, as they can't really be held responsible for false advertising done "independently" by their customers.
Tesla does a metric ton of marketing. What they don’t do is traditional advertising, but they clearly know how to get lots of coverage.
 

gwestr

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Lol 265 front and 305 rear tires. Make that 190 miles of range.
 

Friedrich

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That ‘Ring lap definitely used over 30% of the battery. I’m saying you can only do 2-3 of them.
No information was given on the Porsche of how much power was
That ‘Ring lap definitely used over 30% of the battery. I’m saying you can only do 2-3 of them.
Actually, it was the Tesla Model 3 that used 30% on the Ring lap, as disclosed by the test driver of the Model 3. No information was given on the Porsche, so its silly to comment on that. But the Taycan is on an 800 volt system vs the 400 volt system, the Tesla probably experienced high battery temperature problems meaning inefficiency.. When the Model S ran the ring, the car automatically took the car out of the performance mode. I am sure when the Tesla Roadster comes out, Tesla will have improved their battery temperature management system taking cues from Porsche. The Porsche engineering targeted sustained performance so Porsche developed a much more sophisticated temperature management system than Tesla, so at sustained high performance driving, the Porsche should do better.....we will see.....

If you drive slowly, then there are no battery temperature issues on the Tesla, and you will have longer range than on the Taycan. Eventually I am sure Tesla will catch up with Porsche on battery temperature management engineering. I don't slam Tesla because of its great range and intend to get they Model Y since it is a small SUV, it will be my second everyday car. And hopefully Porsche will eventually have better battery for longer range.

The reality is that actually it is nonsense to compare the vehicles, as they are not really competition. Yes, Tesla has its "performance" versions of their cars, but its actually only a small proportion of the sales. The Model 3 was intended to be the car of the masses, to bring EV to t he mainstream, which is an absolutely amazing accomplishment of the Elon Musk and Tesla. Without Tesla, the Taycan probably would not yet exist yet (or was it Dieselgate that inspired the VW Group). They are designed for different purposes. The Taycan is designed to be an EV that drives like a Porsche, a true sports sedan.

Also, when you are looking at sports cars, you must ALWAYS look at the handling. How well is the steering suspension engineered. How does it perform a high speeds and on a slalom? My expectation, is that the handling and control of the Porsche will be infinitely better than the Tesla, similar to the 911 and Panamera. I remember in the 1990s, I had at the original Acura NSX and a Porsche 911. The Porsche was faster than the NSX on a straight acceleration, but in the slalom on super curvy mountain road, the NSX was just the most amazing car. I was able to drive it much faster. It was so stable and the steering so nimble, that you felt like you could do a switchback curve at any speed. Fear was the only limiting factor of mountain driving (and sometimes traffic)....oh, and I meant fear of a highway patrolman lurking around the corner....lol. The stability, steering control, and even comfort were just out of this world for 1990s sports cars. I was a fan of both cars, but for handling, the NSX was better, for speed, the Porsche.

So with a Tesla, I will be happy with the range, the high tech "cool" car that has amazing acceleration and will be a great utility vehicle for my work. The Taycan will be our fun sports car with amazing performance and handling, not to mention beauty and prestige, the car I will take out on the town and to the mountains (if i find charging stations....lol)
 
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gwestr

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What you said makes no sense. High battery temperature is the definition of efficiency. High motor temperature is what forces performance limiting. The Model 3 has no problems with performance limiting. Having tracked it myself as many others have, I can confirm there is no degradation in performance. ICE cars are far more variable. You are conflating impressions you have of Model S with Model 3, which is easy to do given the negative press about the best vehicle ever produced up until Taycan.

The 800V or 400V has nothing to do with anything - maybe it’s that Porsche used 2 PSM motors instead of mixing. It’s about as stupid as VW Group touting 48V systems vs 24V or 12V systems, which is something that ONLY matters to the supplier networks. Consumers don’t care and shouldn’t care.

It’s very easy to estimate the energy output needed to travel at high speed, given a car’s drag and weight. If you owned a performance EV you’d know! It will certainly use 30 kWh. They can’t cheat the laws of physics, and if anything VW group has fallen fall short of the efficiency curve Tesla has found which others said was impossible.
 

dennis

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The reality is that actually it is nonsense to compare the vehicles, as they are not really competition. Yes, Tesla has its "performance" versions of their cars, but its actually only a small proportion of the sales. The Model 3 was intended to be the car of the masses, to bring EV to t he mainstream, which is an absolutely amazing accomplishment of the Elon Musk and Tesla. Without Tesla, the Taycan probably would not yet exist yet (or was it Dieselgate that inspired the VW Group). They are designed for different purposes. The Taycan is designed to be an EV that drives like a Porsche, a true sports sedan.

Also, when you are looking at sports cars, you must ALWAYS look at the handling. How well is the steering suspension engineered.
While "the Model 3 was intended to be the car for the masses", don't pooh-pooh the the Performance version and especially Track Mode. Tesla did a lot of development work on Track Mode at Thunderhill Raceway in NorCal. (I know because my son's friend is a test driver for Tesla). Subsequently they hired Randy Pobst for a day of track mode tuning at Willow Springs. They documented the experience of having the engineer sitting in the passenger seat dial in his suggested changes in real time while on the track in the Motor Trend article below.

I'm sure the Taycan will have better handling than the M3P. But it will also cost $90K-$150K, well out of range for many people who can afford the $55K M3P.

https://www.tesla.com/blog/how-track-mode-works

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/tes...erformance-track-mode-release-version-review/
 

newreef77

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There is a very simple physics: P=U*I (U=R*I) and that means there is a massive difference between 200/400/800V. Means with same power less current and losses......
Very simple, same with permanent synchron motors. They are different (efficency) even u don´t care.......


What you said makes no sense. High battery temperature is the definition of efficiency. High motor temperature is what forces performance limiting. The Model 3 has no problems with performance limiting. Having tracked it myself as many others have, I can confirm there is no degradation in performance. ICE cars are far more variable. You are conflating impressions you have of Model S with Model 3, which is easy to do given the negative press about the best vehicle ever produced up until Taycan.

The 800V or 400V has nothing to do with anything - maybe it’s that Porsche used 2 PSM motors instead of mixing. It’s about as stupid as VW Group touting 48V systems vs 24V or 12V systems, which is something that ONLY matters to the supplier networks. Consumers don’t care and shouldn’t care.

It’s very easy to estimate the energy output needed to travel at high speed, given a car’s drag and weight. If you owned a performance EV you’d know! It will certainly use 30 kWh. They can’t cheat the laws of physics, and if anything VW group has fallen fall short of the efficiency curve Tesla has found which others said was impossible.
 

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The 800V or 400V has nothing to do with anything -
I.
Ummm....dont mean to be disrespectful, but you might want to learn about physics and electricity, especially, since you have an electric car. The higher the voltage, the more efficient it is. And high battery temperature not only destroys the life of the battery, but it always decreases efficiency.

this is why Porsche stressed engineering on battery temperature management and used a higher voltage. The goal was sustained performance over simple range.

And so you don't think I am biased, I am a BIG Tesla fan, plan on buying the Y as a everyday work vehicle to replace my aging ICE SUV
 

gwestr

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Ummm....dont mean to be disrespectful, but you might want to learn about physics and electricity, especially, since you have an electric car. The higher the voltage, the more efficient it is. And high battery temperature not only destroys the life of the battery, but it always decreases efficiency.

this is why Porsche stressed engineering on battery temperature management and used a higher voltage. The goal was sustained performance over simple range.

And so you don't think I am biased, I am a BIG Tesla fan, plan on buying the Y as a everyday work vehicle to replace my aging ICE SUV
OK, so I guess the Taycan is so inefficient it needs an 800V system. Otherwise it would have like 500 miles of range, right guys? Maybe someone can tweet @elonmusk I bet he has never heard of 800V drive systems and 48V auxiliary systems. Some real next level stuff on that 150 mile Audi.
 

felixtb

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The Audi is not 800V. But it’s is more expensive and would have been too experimental to go for at the time of the development of the S and the X. So the 3 and the Y had to follow. Would be my suggestion of why TESLA is 400V instead of 800V. Just cheaper simpler and was a known quantity as reliability etc with these seizes of batteries all ready back at the beginning of this century. :)
 

gwestr

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From my buddy who actually does this for a living, rather than all of us college 200 level physicists:

FDEADD4E-AB61-4784-B885-1E04C04340F2.jpeg
 

gwestr

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We all know Tesla is the leader in smallest length of wiring harnesses. That 4500 pound Porsche probably has 300 pounds of wiring in it. Tesla Model Y is supposed to be down to 20 pounds.

Theoretical labratory fast charging is great, but Porsche’s US charging network is basically a bunch of 50 kW chargers. Only Tesla has a natoinwide network of 150 kW chargers which are all being upgraded to 250 kW.
 

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