4S to Turbo - is it worth it?

[KTC]

Regarding range, @KTC and I work together and live near by as well. I will say the very best range I ever got on my commute in my 4S was around 29kWh/100mi. This morning, I drove to work as mellow as possible In range mode with zero traffic and was only barely able to squeak out 37kWh/1000 in my Turbo S.

Just for giggles, this morning's hypermiling attempt with driving like an old nanny, with numerous people giving me the eye or the finger. Conditions were:
- Ambient 55F, battery temp 65F
- A/C turned off. Could not turn off headlights. No interior heating or music used.
- Maximum pedal force < 3 lbs ballpark, acceleration was about 1 mph/sec getting to highway speeds. On some rolling hills it was unable to maintain speed going uphill.
- No "throttle" once speed hits 60mph. Downhill coast reached 64 mph at one point.
- Slow regen braking maximized to also hit all intersections at green light to minimize any braking/accelerations.

This was the best I could do.

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[Ross]

Love it. A bit of fun.
if you drive for longer it will drop to 25!
I find the slower you go the less you get
and
The more you get and

 

[Ross]

Frozen Blue so should be easy to spot...though unlikely to be doing much whizzing until I've build up my G-force tolerance . The plan is to have just "Taycan" on the back, which on a CT will unintentionally make it unique unless there are others out there daft enough to spend money editing the name
What colour will your beast be?
(PS I'm impressed you understood my old timer user name )

Lovely Frozen Blue.
My mate has a CT4 that colour!
I went for Crayon again as couldn’t like anything’s else as much!
Best looking on a GTS with black bits and Black Spyders and those cheeky
red callipers.
Too much of a tight Northerner for second choice. PTS Viper Green.

 

[TAYC4S]

To answer the OP question on range - 2 years and several thousand miles of Turbo ownership, Mission-E wheels, driven around the UK, a mixture of London city and motorway 71mph *cough* driving, and my range is a rock solid 220-225 miles.

Whoever is getting 180miles earlier in this thread must be driving with an anchor hanging out the back.

Is that range at 100% charge presumably? So its about 25 miles under the 4S+ with 21’s. Thanks, that’s useful to know.

 

[SteveMc]

Is that range at 100% charge presumably? So its about 25 miles under the 4S+ with 21’s. Thanks, that’s useful to know.

Correct.

 

[Skilly]

Is that range at 100% charge presumably? So its about 25 miles under the 4S+ with 21’s. Thanks, that’s useful to know.

range should be range. Like an ICE car measures MPG - its the same full tank or 1/4 tank.

That said, real world driving in the 4S is really about the same. Again, Im the constant in driving both and they are identical in the consumption. 2.4 to 2.5 miles per kW. I could of course get more (many here do!) but like for like driving in each yielded the same consumption over a period of months of driving in the same patterns.

There aren't a lot of people, except perhaps experimentally, driving 100% to 0%. Its not practical really. So the only real world view of consumption is going to be miles per kW. From there, battery capacity will tell you what a full charge could yield. And short of a change in driving (like a long roadtrip full of constant freeway) you can be pretty accurate on what you can expect.

These things are just like ICE in that way. In terms of range it's pretty much city, highway and average. Translated for me in miles per kW, I've seen 1.8/3.5/2.4...that too was pretty consistent between the 4S and Turbo too.

 

[RCorsa]

Wow.

Just for giggles, this morning's hypermiling attempt with driving like an old nanny, with numerous people giving me the eye or the finger. Conditions were:
- Ambient 55F, battery temp 65F
- A/C turned off. Could not turn off headlights. No interior heating or music used.
- Maximum pedal force < 3 lbs ballpark, acceleration was about 1 mph/sec getting to highway speeds. On some rolling hills it was unable to maintain speed going uphill.
- No "throttle" once speed hits 60mph. Downhill coast reached 64 mph at one point.
- Slow regen braking maximized to also hit all intersections at green light to minimize any braking/accelerations.

This was the best I could do.

That’s pretty good @KTC This would get you well over 300miles range. Not sure if you can divide the 28 into the 93 battery pack (I assume it’s not linear like that) or you would have around 330. You have the 21 inch exclusivewheels I think so it surprising your turbo KWH is so much better than my S. I need to try again maybe. Maybe more tires pressure? Do you precondition your battery at night? I’m not even sure how to do that but my garage is heated at 70 degrees.

 

[RCorsa]

Have you ever done any track time? I’ve done a fair amount. If so tell me the physics of what happens to a car with super hard strong braking prior to entering a turn. The more powerful brakes will have a increase downforce on the front end of the car to allow you to hold the turn better. The inverse occurs with hard force acceleration which is why manufacturers add different components to spoilers and rear diffusers with more powerful cars. If a Porsche engineer tells me there is zero difference with arguably one of the highest performance cars they’ve produced I’ll buy it otherwise my 18months of personal experience says no way.

 

[Skilly]

Have you ever done any track time? I’ve done a fair amount. If so tell me the physics of what happens to a car with super hard strong braking prior to entering a turn. The more powerful brakes will have a increase downforce on the front end of the car to allow you to hold the turn better. The inverse occurs with hard force acceleration which is why manufacturers add different components to spoilers and rear diffusers with more powerful cars. If a Porsche engineer tells me there is zero difference with arguably one of the highest performance cars they’ve produced I’ll buy it otherwise my 18months of personal experience says no way.

"have you ever done any track time" or aka "bro, do you even lift?"....smh.

You're all over the map. And, welp...I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.

and this...."The more powerful brakes will have a increase downforce on the front end of the car" . This is not downforce.

PS - reducing speed REDUCES and ELIMINATES downforce. Downforce is a byproduct of aero and speed (aka air movement)

 

[RCorsa]

 

[BeauJTaylor]

I'm always interested in the financial aspect of things and one thing I keep seeing repeated is that the Turbo only adds X dollars (15-16K) of options at an increase of X dollars (33k?). I'm not arguing that part of the equation as you're essentially paying the delta for the upgraded power etc.

BUT:

I'm less interested in the front end difference and more the residual difference on re-sale. It would seem to me (without evidence, maybe you Porsche lifers can help here) that the residual value of a Turbo would fall less than a highly optioned 4S to match the Turbo would, meaning that ~15-17K difference up front gets drastically reduced when it comes time to sell the vehicle. Am I off here? I feel like if the residual is just a few thousand dollars (plus the added opportunity cost of the additional money outlay for the Turbo), then the Turbo seems like an easy bargain over the similar specced 4S? This isn't a comparison of base 4S, but a 4S specced to match a lower specced Turbo where you can.

 

[smoothound]

my quote for a lease of a moderately optioned Turbo vs a highly options 4S had a significantly higher final value for the Turbo - I guess this is specific to leasing - maybe is just a UK thing?

The evidence was in the monthly lease figures themselves - high optioned 4S at around ~108K GBP (from memory) and moderately optioned Turbo at ~130K GBP - resulted in a relatively small delta per month.

This matches my experience with other Lease deals for my previous cars - The customer pays for the full cost of the options over the term of the lease - these make no contribution to the final value.

Whereas standard features (even if the same functions as 'options' on a lesser model) contribute to some degree towards the final value at the end of the lease (after depreciation at the same rate as the car). In addition the higher spec car also has an inherently higher final value than a lesser model

This reduces the delta in monthly lease payments.

Anyways - its not my opinion on this - its actual quotes form my local OCP.... maybe different elsewhere I guess.

cheers

 

[BeauJTaylor]

Do you mind sharing the MSRP to final (residual) value for both? Are both same timeframe, all things equal outside of the car itself?

 

[smoothound]

I will try to find them - was around 8 months ago - then changed to Turbo

one thing I did ask for was a PCP quote for a 4s with absolutely no options whatsoever and one fully stacked - the guaranteed final value was the same for both. IMHO This is how an OPC (or any dealership offering PCP) make big bucks - ....... add lots of options - pay fully for them and then hand a well specced car over to the OPC at the end of the lease if you walk away ...... (unless you put it in PX again and they give a good offer - then you may claw something back).

Will have a look later tonight - but now I am going for a Turbo I think I have binned the 4S figs - will check and get back later

cheers

 

[f1eng]

The more powerful brakes will have a increase downforce on the front end of the car

You are confusing weight transfer for downforce.

Chassis wise a 4S with rear axle steering, torque vectoring and PDCC will, obviously actually, be better than either a Turbo or Turbo S.

Road car size spoilers make infinitesimally small contributions to wheel load for cornering, they are fitted to kill lift for stability on motorways.

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