Setting up for charging in garage

[KenU]

Thanks guys!

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[Miwa]

All your charger knows is that there is a 30A plug on it, so the charger limits you to 24A. Even if you update the outlet and use an adapter, you wont get more than 24A because the Porsche cable tells the charger what plug is on the end.

 

[KenU]

All your charger knows is that there is a 30A plug on it, so the charger limits you to 24A. Even if you update the outlet and use an adapter, you wont get more than 24A because the Porsche cable tells the charger what plug is on the end.

This makes sense, I kinda knew it had to do with the plug somehow but got more confused when all the different breaker info came into the mix. Thanks!

 

[BlueShoes]

So are you saying the 40 amp breaker is too much (hot) for the receptacle that the 14-30 is plugged into? should be a 30 amp breaker instead?
Is there an electrician “in the house”?

No, I’m saying that if you have a circuit spec’d for 50amps and you’re running a 30amp load it’s fine. Conceivably, b/c you have a 30amp plug, you’re not able to overload the circuit. What is dangerous is to just put a 14-50 outlet on a 30amp circuit. That’s fire stuff there. I’m also saying you need to remember the 20% buffer you have to have on the circuit. Taycan will max out at 40amp, add 20% and that means you need a circuit rated for 48amps which doesn’t exist so you go up to 50amp.

I think it's much more important that the wire be rated at or over the breaker. but an electrician told me that the breaker was intended to protect both the wire and the receptacles. So for my shop where I wanted a 20 amp circuit we had to find 20 amp rated receptacles.

Wire can be rated at or over the breaker as the larger wire will have a lower impedance helping with voltage drop. You’ll see that the ampacity of the cable is a factor of diameter and distance so while one guy may need 4awg another may get by with 6awg. Also, different wires have different temperature ratings which make a difference too. Individual conductors vs. a bundle like romex changes it even more. Higher amperage runs are not nearly as straight forward as just feeding a 15amp circuit through the office.

Correct! US code requires the breaker to be no larger than the lowest-rated part of the circuit, including the receptacle (socket).

I had to go back and check NEC b/c I couldn’t remember exactly the nuances here. I talked through my setup with an electrician and it’s safe - but you’re right that it’s not per code. It’s safe b/c my circuit is rated for 60amps and we know the only load it’s used for is 40amps so there is no issue with a 50amp outlet and 60amp breaker b/c the purpose is overload and we’re within tolerances. I could simply swap the 60amp breaker with a 50amp breaker and be code compliant. The part that had me having to pull down the code is we routinely have 15amp outlets on 20amp circuits. Curiously, and I didn’t know this, if you have a single outlet (not a duplex) on the circuit your outlet and breaker have to match. This is amusing b/c I have that exact scenario on a recently built house and it wasn’t a problem for the inspector to have a single 15amp outlet (not duplex) on a dedicated 20amp feed. Oh well. Either way though, that’s not relevant here b/c that nuance stops I believe 20amp circuits anyway.

 

[KenU]

No, I’m saying that if you have a circuit spec’d for 50amps and you’re running a 30amp load it’s fine. Conceivably, b/c you have a 30amp plug, you’re not able to overload the circuit. What is dangerous is to just put a 14-50 outlet on a 30amp circuit. That’s fire stuff there. I’m also saying you need to remember the 20% buffer you have to have on the circuit. Taycan will max out at 40amp, add 20% and that means you need a circuit rated for 48amps which doesn’t exist so you go up to 50amp.


Wire can be rated at or over the breaker as the larger wire will have a lower impedance helping with voltage drop. You’ll see that the ampacity of the cable is a factor of diameter and distance so while one guy may need 4awg another may get by with 6awg. Also, different wires have different temperature ratings which make a difference too. Individual conductors vs. a bundle like romex changes it even more. Higher amperage runs are not nearly as straight forward as just feeding a 15amp circuit through the office.


I had to go back and check NEC b/c I couldn’t remember exactly the nuances here. I talked through my setup with an electrician and it’s safe - but you’re right that it’s not per code. It’s safe b/c my circuit is rated for 60amps and we know the only load it’s used for is 40amps so there is no issue with a 50amp outlet and 60amp breaker b/c the purpose is overload and we’re within tolerances. I could simply swap the 60amp breaker with a 50amp breaker and be code compliant. The part that had me having to pull down the code is we routinely have 15amp outlets on 20amp circuits. Curiously, and I didn’t know this, if you have a single outlet (not a duplex) on the circuit your outlet and breaker have to match. This is amusing b/c I have that exact scenario on a recently built house and it wasn’t a problem for the inspector to have a single 15amp outlet (not duplex) on a dedicated 20amp feed. Oh well. Either way though, that’s not relevant here b/c that nuance stops I believe 20amp circuits anyway.

Thanks, David!

 

[HelfFL]

Same for me - in my case it's the cable from the charger into the 14-50 receptacle that gets too warm to the touch after a while.

One other thing I forgot to mention: make sure the cable is completely unwound from the charging unit, no cable should be wrapped around the charging unit, meaning that if your car is 10 feet from the charging unit let the entire 25 ft cable rest on the ground. My personal hang-up is not that particular cable being warm - it’s the 14-30 plug in the receptacle that gets hot, not warm.

I tried this - unwrapped the cable from the charging dock and tried to stretch out the 25' cable as much as possible. The cable plugged into the receptacle is still warm but not too hot to the touch as I encountered in previous charges. So stretching out the 25' cable seems to definitely help dissipate the heat build-up somewhat.

 

[KenU]

I tried this - unwrapped the cable from the charging dock and tried to stretch out the 25' cable as much as possible. The cable plugged into the receptacle is still warm but not too hot to the touch as I encountered in previous charges. So stretching out the 25' cable seems to definitely help dissipate the heat build-up somewhat.

Good to hear. Finally got the 14-50 plug installed today, including the 50amp breaker, pushing 40A, charging now. After about an hour now what’s interesting is the plug itself is not as hot to the touch as was the 14-30 plug but the 14-50 plug’s cable is very warm bordering hot, whereas the 14-30’s was not as warm. Also, the 25 ft cable to the car‘s charging port is much warmer than when the 14-30 was used.
I’m sure there is some explanation for this but I don’t have a degree in electrical engineering, so it’s all puzzling to me - that everything is the opposite in terms of temperature between the 2 plugs and their respective cables including the 25 ft cable.
I’m still from the camp that’s not comfortable with all this heat in the wiring, etc and retiring for the evening without checking intermittently having other very expensive cars sitting in the garage.
The above could all be normal, but that’s just me....

 

[ron_b]

Good to hear. Finally got the 14-50 plug installed today pushing 40A, charging now. After about an hour now what’s interesting is the plug itself is not as hot to the touch as was the 14-30 plug but the 14-50 plug’s cable is very warm bordering hot, whereas the 14-30’s was not as warm. Also, the 25 ft cable to the car‘s charging port is much warmer than when the 14-30 was used.
I’m sure there is some explanation for this but I don’t have a degree in electrical engineering, so it’s all puzzling to me - that everything is the opposite in terms of temperature between the 2 plugs and their respective cables including the 25 ft cable.
I’m still from the camp that’s not comfortable with all this heat in wiring, etc and retiring for the evening without checking intermittently having other very expensive cars sitting in the garage.
The above could all be normal, but that’s just me....

You can lower the charging current to say 30Amps if you are not comfortable, just takes a little longer to charge.

The wire for the 14-30 was probably a smaller gauge which is why when pulling even 24 amps would warm it up. 24 amps would not warm up the main cable. Then when going to a 14-50 plug which is rated for 50 amps it's not as serious but pulling 40A of n the main cable must have noticable loss. Have to get a a Fleur thermal imaging camera to check the cable temperature versus ambient temperature.

 

[KenU]

You can lower the charging current to say 30Amps if you are not comfortable, just takes a little longer to charge.
the wire for the 14-30 was probably a smaller gauge which is why when pulling even 24 amps would warm it up. 24 amps would not warm up the main cable. Then when going to a 14-50 plug which is rated for 50 amps it's not as serious but pulling 40A of n the main cable must have noticable loss. Have to get a a Fleur thermal imaging camera to check the cable temperature versus ambient temperature.

Thanks, Ron. I’m assuming that would be in the settings icon on the charger?

 

[ron_b]

Thanks, Ron. I’m assuming that would be in the settings icon on the charger?

Yes, I assume you got a manual with it let me be more complete but the online one is on this post.
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/best-home-chargers-for-taycan-turbo-in-us.1140/post-16486

Page 13 speaks of setting the current limit but in such vague terms I cannot add much detail. I assume it will be obvious in the menus. Screenshot attached.

 

[Miwa]

The cable getting hot isn't what I'd worry about, it's rated for operation. It's your outlet and wall wiring that has to be OK for the continuous draw. If the cable heats up too much, there's probably a temperature sensor in the EVSE that would notice if the cable was getting too hot.

 

[KenU]

Yes, I assume you got a manual with it let me be more complete but the online one is on this post.
https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/best-home-chargers-for-taycan-turbo-in-us.1140/post-16486

Page 13 speaks of setting the current limit but in such vague terms I cannot add much detail. I assume it will be obvious in the menus. Screenshot attached.

Yes, I do have the manual but consider this forum more easily accessible and getting explanations in more detail by people such as yourself which I find very informative and personal coming from people much smarter than me, rather than reading pages in a manual. This all began with reading in the manual the 1st day about using the “14-50” plug. - which it did NOT come with. Then came here for answers.
Thanks again!

 

[daveo4EV]

based on this thread - https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/t...020-taycan-has-11-kw-l2-charger-48-amps.1793/

if you can handle electrically - I'm changing my recommendation to a 60 amp EVSE (48 amp charge rate) for North America - that means a hardwired circuit rather than a NEMA plug- but if you are "installing" a charger in your garage hardwire will be no issue…and no difference in cost. a 60 amp circuit will slightly increase the wire cost (small gauge wire required) but no difference in labor costs.

for this you'll need a non-porsche charger - since Porsche doesn't make a 60/48 amp charger - but fortunately there are very high quality J-1772 EVSE's that will charge the Taycan just fine…

Clipper Creek HCS-60 comes to mind as very high quality charger at the HCS-60 will use a 60 amp breaker and provide a 48 amp (11 kW) charge rate - my 2020 Taycan happily charges at 10.68 kW from my 60 amp EVSE…

this means you can fully charge a Taycan from --100% in less than 8 hours…vs. the 10 hours from a 40 amp charger…

no a big deal - but if you spec'ing a garage install from scratch there is _NO_ harm in installing a 60 amp J-1772 - and the cost difference is likely to be negligible for a 50 vs. 60 amp circuit…

and in 7 years of EV ownership no one has ever said my EV charges tooo fast - I gotta slow it down - so if you can charge faster. Why not?

 

[KenU]

I'm curious if anyone who has the 14-50 plug, 50 Amp breaker and 6 gauge wire to the wall receptacle, can please check to see how hot your plug and its wire connected at top of charger gets after about 90 minutes of charging? Warm, hot to the squeeze, etc? Other wires are warm, as expected. Dealer cannot explain this and electrician has confirmed proper installation. Someone in Service Dept suggested possibly replacing charger.. Thanks

 

[HelfFL]

I'm curious if anyone who has the 14-50 plug, 50 Amp breaker and 6 gauge wire to the wall receptacle, can please check to see how hot your plug and its wire connected at top of charger gets after about 90 minutes of charging? Warm, hot to the squeeze, etc? Other wires are warm, as expected. Dealer cannot explain this and electrician has confirmed proper installation. Someone in Service Dept suggested possibly replacing charger.. Thanks

My dealer asked me to bring in my car and the charger to check it out as I'm experiencing the same condition. A few nights ago I had my 50 amp circuit trip after about 2 hours of charging. I tried to charge again today and I got an error on my charger about the circuit tripping. I unplugged the charger, plugged it back in and dialed down the amperage on the charger to 32 to lighten the load. That worked very well and the cable stayed cool but charging was obviously slower. Will let you know what my dealer says after they look at the car and charger.

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